Strummer ad-libs

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Aeneas
Dirty Punk
Posts: 67
Joined: 25 Oct 2015, 1:42am

Re: Strummer ad-libs

Post by Aeneas »

muppet hi fi wrote:
14 Sep 2017, 10:39pm
Aeneas wrote:
14 Sep 2017, 10:18pm
muppet hi fi wrote:
14 Sep 2017, 8:28pm
Aeneas wrote:
14 Sep 2017, 6:16pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
14 Sep 2017, 4:15pm


Google the phrase "spliff bunker." Joe was no candidate for the Straight Edge life.
I meant hard drugs.
After all, the line "a spliff, a pound, a half a pint of brown"
is his early 1978 band confession.
Of course, even spliffs can cause brain damage.
And eventually Strummer ousted Mick Jones from the band around 1984
for spliffs.
i.e. in 6 years, Strummer learned something about all drugs.
Joe didn't oust Mick for smoking weed; it was for Mick's work habits and the usual "artistic differences". Also because of his own ego and insecurities.

And Joe was - aside from being a speed freak early on and an inveterate weed smoker himself - a heavy alcohol drinker - the most dangerous of all widely available drugs.
This is revisionism.
It was known at the time that Jones was having trouble focusing on
his music role in the band because of drugs.
In fact, Jones had lost weight and many at the time also thought he had
a cocaine problem.
It was at this time that Strummer publicly swore off all drugs,
amid the turmoil and inability to complete songs.
Sheeesh. OK, young mang, whatever you say. :rolleyes:
Of course, it would be interesting to know if Mick Jones received
a better payment and royalty deal from his record contract
with Big Audio Dynamite, than they had with The Clash.
That might have given Jones an incentive to behave as he did,
forcing his own ouster.

Aeneas
Dirty Punk
Posts: 67
Joined: 25 Oct 2015, 1:42am

Re: Strummer ad-libs

Post by Aeneas »

Marky Dread wrote:
14 Sep 2017, 4:34pm
Low Down Low wrote:
14 Sep 2017, 4:22pm
Drugs' raids were a common enough feature in UK cities back then, particularly in the high rises. I'm sure Joe witnessed one or two in his time. I witnessed one myself in London in the late 80s and it was indeed "raining" drugs as all manner of packages were thrown out windows as the cop cars screeched to a halt outside. Apart from the obvious dramatisation of the murders, those lines are pretty evocative for me anyway.
Yep still a regular ocurrence in the flats right behind my home.
Could be Strummer was trying to show in this lyric just how clumsy
these raids were, not intended to catch anyone, certainly not
a drug kingpin -- the screech of the tires, the clumsy, noisy
"clumping up the stairs" by officers, trademark "black shoes"
from the police uniform store -- nothing stealthy about these raids at all.
Police seemed to going out of their way to give advance notice
of their presence.
Just 'show raids' for appearances, to make citizens think their police tax
dollars/pounds were going to good use.

Marky Dread
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Messiah of the Milk Bar
Posts: 58888
Joined: 17 Jun 2008, 11:26am

Re: Strummer ad-libs

Post by Marky Dread »

Aeneas wrote:
15 Sep 2017, 8:42am
Marky Dread wrote:
14 Sep 2017, 4:34pm
Low Down Low wrote:
14 Sep 2017, 4:22pm
Drugs' raids were a common enough feature in UK cities back then, particularly in the high rises. I'm sure Joe witnessed one or two in his time. I witnessed one myself in London in the late 80s and it was indeed "raining" drugs as all manner of packages were thrown out windows as the cop cars screeched to a halt outside. Apart from the obvious dramatisation of the murders, those lines are pretty evocative for me anyway.
Yep still a regular ocurrence in the flats right behind my home.
Could be Strummer was trying to show in this lyric just how clumsy
these raids were, not intended to catch anyone, certainly not
a drug kingpin -- the screech of the tires, the clumsy, noisy
"clumping up the stairs" by officers, trademark "black shoes"
from the police uniform store -- nothing stealthy about these raids at all.
Police seemed to going out of their way to give advance notice
of their presence.
Just 'show raids' for appearances, to make citizens think their police tax
dollars/pounds were going to good use.
I can't make any UK/US comparisons having lived my whole life here in the UK. However I have witnessed police brutality first hand on more than enough ocassions. In the 70's we had the SUS law where the police could stop and search you on sight without any onther reason than you looked suspicious. Many of my black friends were stopped this way as was I in my punk days. A lot of the police that stopped you would be in plain clothes and in unmarked cars. Go watch the movie "Rude Boy" it clearly shows this type of event. The police here did nothing "for appearance" then or now and make these raids to get a collar and enter their paperwork for a quota to justify their being.

I see your sticking with "clumping up the stairs". These raids are not clumsy at all they are pre-planned and often very early dawn raids in order to catch out the unsuspecting. Joe was talking from experience, as 101 Walterton has already mentioned most likely from his squatting days through to his looking different as a punk.
Image

Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty


We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.

"Without the common people you're nothing"

Nos Sumus Una Familia

muppet hi fi
Unknown Immortal
Posts: 5190
Joined: 19 Feb 2009, 1:10pm

Re: Strummer ad-libs

Post by muppet hi fi »

Aeneas wrote:
15 Sep 2017, 8:11am
muppet hi fi wrote:
14 Sep 2017, 10:39pm
Aeneas wrote:
14 Sep 2017, 10:18pm
muppet hi fi wrote:
14 Sep 2017, 8:28pm
Aeneas wrote:
14 Sep 2017, 6:16pm

I meant hard drugs.
After all, the line "a spliff, a pound, a half a pint of brown"
is his early 1978 band confession.
Of course, even spliffs can cause brain damage.
And eventually Strummer ousted Mick Jones from the band around 1984
for spliffs.
i.e. in 6 years, Strummer learned something about all drugs.
Joe didn't oust Mick for smoking weed; it was for Mick's work habits and the usual "artistic differences". Also because of his own ego and insecurities.

And Joe was - aside from being a speed freak early on and an inveterate weed smoker himself - a heavy alcohol drinker - the most dangerous of all widely available drugs.
This is revisionism.
It was known at the time that Jones was having trouble focusing on
his music role in the band because of drugs.
In fact, Jones had lost weight and many at the time also thought he had
a cocaine problem.
It was at this time that Strummer publicly swore off all drugs,
amid the turmoil and inability to complete songs.
Sheeesh. OK, young mang, whatever you say. :rolleyes:
Of course, it would be interesting to know if Mick Jones received
a better payment and royalty deal from his record contract
with Big Audio Dynamite, than they had with The Clash.
That might have given Jones an incentive to behave as he did,
forcing his own ouster.
Nonsense. BAD didn't exist in the autumn of '83 when Mick was fired. And why would he want to quit the band he'd founded and created two of the biggest hits for (Train In Vain and Should I Stay/Go) and been largely responsible for the expansive influence of?
Strong shoes is what we got and when they're hot they're hot!
- Marky Dread and his fabulous Screaming Blue Messiahs

Aeneas
Dirty Punk
Posts: 67
Joined: 25 Oct 2015, 1:42am

Re: Strummer ad-libs

Post by Aeneas »

Marky Dread wrote:
15 Sep 2017, 11:57am
Aeneas wrote:
15 Sep 2017, 8:42am
Marky Dread wrote:
14 Sep 2017, 4:34pm
Low Down Low wrote:
14 Sep 2017, 4:22pm
Drugs' raids were a common enough feature in UK cities back then, particularly in the high rises. I'm sure Joe witnessed one or two in his time. I witnessed one myself in London in the late 80s and it was indeed "raining" drugs as all manner of packages were thrown out windows as the cop cars screeched to a halt outside. Apart from the obvious dramatisation of the murders, those lines are pretty evocative for me anyway.
Yep still a regular ocurrence in the flats right behind my home.
Could be Strummer was trying to show in this lyric just how clumsy
these raids were, not intended to catch anyone, certainly not
a drug kingpin -- the screech of the tires, the clumsy, noisy
"clumping up the stairs" by officers, trademark "black shoes"
from the police uniform store -- nothing stealthy about these raids at all.
Police seemed to going out of their way to give advance notice
of their presence.
Just 'show raids' for appearances, to make citizens think their police tax
dollars/pounds were going to good use.
I can't make any UK/US comparisons having lived my whole life here in the UK. However I have witnessed police brutality first hand on more than enough occasions. In the 70's we had the SUS law where the police could stop and search you on sight without any other reason than you looked suspicious. Many of my black friends were stopped this way as was I in my punk days. A lot of the police that stopped you would be in plain clothes and in unmarked cars. Go watch the movie "Rude Boy" it clearly shows this type of event. The police here did nothing "for appearance" then or now and make these raids to get a collar and enter their paperwork for a quota to justify their being.

I see you're sticking with "clumping up the stairs". These raids are not clumsy at all they are pre-planned and often very early dawn raids in order to catch out the unsuspecting. Joe was talking from experience, as 101 Walterton has already mentioned most likely from his squatting days through to his looking different as a punk.
We are in complete agreement that the police want to make a collar --
just a show low-level collar, not one or several of the city drug kingpins
who orchestrate drug trafficking usually through circuitous paths
from other countries.
While the low level collar is at the police station, saying "do what officer",
fearing that the narcotics police and the drug kingpin will have him whacked
if he divulges anything,
the drug kingpin continues with business as usual,
making his regular bribe-payments to narcotics officers, to "stay free".

In this country, especially in a place like New York City,
where drugs are widespread,
they have city laws which allow police to "stop and frisk" --
there is definite commonality in that disproportionately most
victims of such searches are 'of color'.
In fact, black famous tennis player James Blake who i am sure
has appeared at Wimbledon was not just "stop and frisked" but
attacked and rammed to the ground in broad daylight by a NYPD officer
a couple of years ago.
The video is probably on Youtube.

Again, these excesses are for show -- drugs are rampant in NYC
and none of these conspicuous attacks on citizens is affecting
the ultimate path of drugs to the street.

As Strummer says: "they arrested every drug which had ever been made" --
but not he drug kingpin, who is protected by narcotics police officers.
And of course FBI/DEA.

Marky Dread
User avatar
Messiah of the Milk Bar
Posts: 58888
Joined: 17 Jun 2008, 11:26am

Re: Strummer ad-libs

Post by Marky Dread »

Aeneas wrote:
15 Sep 2017, 12:33pm
Marky Dread wrote:
15 Sep 2017, 11:57am
Aeneas wrote:
15 Sep 2017, 8:42am
Marky Dread wrote:
14 Sep 2017, 4:34pm
Low Down Low wrote:
14 Sep 2017, 4:22pm
Drugs' raids were a common enough feature in UK cities back then, particularly in the high rises. I'm sure Joe witnessed one or two in his time. I witnessed one myself in London in the late 80s and it was indeed "raining" drugs as all manner of packages were thrown out windows as the cop cars screeched to a halt outside. Apart from the obvious dramatisation of the murders, those lines are pretty evocative for me anyway.
Yep still a regular ocurrence in the flats right behind my home.
Could be Strummer was trying to show in this lyric just how clumsy
these raids were, not intended to catch anyone, certainly not
a drug kingpin -- the screech of the tires, the clumsy, noisy
"clumping up the stairs" by officers, trademark "black shoes"
from the police uniform store -- nothing stealthy about these raids at all.
Police seemed to going out of their way to give advance notice
of their presence.
Just 'show raids' for appearances, to make citizens think their police tax
dollars/pounds were going to good use.
I can't make any UK/US comparisons having lived my whole life here in the UK. However I have witnessed police brutality first hand on more than enough occasions. In the 70's we had the SUS law where the police could stop and search you on sight without any other reason than you looked suspicious. Many of my black friends were stopped this way as was I in my punk days. A lot of the police that stopped you would be in plain clothes and in unmarked cars. Go watch the movie "Rude Boy" it clearly shows this type of event. The police here did nothing "for appearance" then or now and make these raids to get a collar and enter their paperwork for a quota to justify their being.

I see you're sticking with "clumping up the stairs". These raids are not clumsy at all they are pre-planned and often very early dawn raids in order to catch out the unsuspecting. Joe was talking from experience, as 101 Walterton has already mentioned most likely from his squatting days through to his looking different as a punk.
We are in complete agreement that the police want to make a collar --
just a show low-level collar, not one or several of the city drug kingpins
who orchestrate drug trafficking usually through circuitous paths
from other countries.
While the low level collar is at the police station, saying "do what officer",
fearing that the narcotics police and the drug kingpin will have him whacked
if he divulges anything,
the drug kingpin continues with business as usual,
making his regular bribe-payments to narcotics officers, to "stay free".

In this country, especially in a place like New York City,
where drugs are widespread,
they have city laws which allow police to "stop and frisk" --
there is definite commonality in that disproportionately most
victims of such searches are 'of color'.
In fact, black famous tennis player James Blake who i am sure
has appeared at Wimbledon was not just "stop and frisked" but
attacked and rammed to the ground in broad daylight by a NYPD officer
a couple of years ago.
The video is probably on Youtube.

Again, these excesses are for show -- drugs are rampant in NYC
and none of these conspicuous attacks on citizens is affecting
the ultimate path of drugs to the street.

As Strummer says: "they arrested every drug which had ever been made" --
but not he drug kingpin, who is protected by narcotics police officers.
And of course FBI/DEA.
In the UK as I expect elsewhere in the world the drug supplies are funded by very wealthy influential untouchables like those lazy wig wearing fuckers in the House of Lords. These bastards sit around discussing what's right and wrong fong for us all "sitting making laws all day" while funding drugs/terroism and all manner of evil shit. The police may pick up the man on the street/the supplier/other middle men but they can't touch the Lords and no one will ever get that far up the ladder.
Image

Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty


We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.

"Without the common people you're nothing"

Nos Sumus Una Familia

Silent Majority
Singer-Songwriter Nancy
Posts: 18702
Joined: 10 Nov 2008, 8:28pm
Location: South Londoner in the Midlands.

Re: Strummer ad-libs

Post by Silent Majority »

Between the weed of his whole life, dabbles in trying heroin, a period of coke in the early to mid eighties and with the Groucho set, speed in the seventies, ecstasy in the mid to late nineties, I'd be surprised to learn their were many drugs that Strummer never flirted with.
a lifetime serving one machine
Is ten times worse than prison


www.pexlives.libsyn.com/

Aeneas
Dirty Punk
Posts: 67
Joined: 25 Oct 2015, 1:42am

Re: Strummer ad-libs

Post by Aeneas »

Marky Dread wrote:
15 Sep 2017, 12:52pm
Aeneas wrote:
15 Sep 2017, 12:33pm
Marky Dread wrote:
15 Sep 2017, 11:57am
Aeneas wrote:
15 Sep 2017, 8:42am
Marky Dread wrote:
14 Sep 2017, 4:34pm

Yep still a regular ocurrence in the flats right behind my home.
Could be Strummer was trying to show in this lyric just how clumsy
these raids were, not intended to catch anyone, certainly not
a drug kingpin -- the screech of the tires, the clumsy, noisy
"clumping up the stairs" by officers, trademark "black shoes"
from the police uniform store -- nothing stealthy about these raids at all.
Police seemed to going out of their way to give advance notice
of their presence.
Just 'show raids' for appearances, to make citizens think their police tax
dollars/pounds were going to good use.
I can't make any UK/US comparisons having lived my whole life here in the UK. However I have witnessed police brutality first hand on more than enough occasions. In the 70's we had the SUS law where the police could stop and search you on sight without any other reason than you looked suspicious. Many of my black friends were stopped this way as was I in my punk days. A lot of the police that stopped you would be in plain clothes and in unmarked cars. Go watch the movie "Rude Boy" it clearly shows this type of event. The police here did nothing "for appearance" then or now and make these raids to get a collar and enter their paperwork for a quota to justify their being.

I see you're sticking with "clumping up the stairs". These raids are not clumsy at all they are pre-planned and often very early dawn raids in order to catch out the unsuspecting. Joe was talking from experience, as 101 Walterton has already mentioned most likely from his squatting days through to his looking different as a punk.
We are in complete agreement that the police want to make a collar --
just a show low-level collar, not one or several of the city drug kingpins
who orchestrate drug trafficking usually through circuitous paths
from other countries.
While the low level collar is at the police station, saying "do what officer",
fearing that the narcotics police and the drug kingpin will have him whacked
if he divulges anything,
the drug kingpin continues with business as usual,
making his regular bribe-payments to narcotics officers, to "stay free".

In this country, especially in a place like New York City,
where drugs are widespread,
they have city laws which allow police to "stop and frisk" --
there is definite commonality in that disproportionately most
victims of such searches are 'of color'.
In fact, black famous tennis player James Blake who i am sure
has appeared at Wimbledon was not just "stop and frisked" but
attacked and rammed to the ground in broad daylight by a NYPD officer
a couple of years ago.
The video is probably on Youtube.

Again, these excesses are for show -- drugs are rampant in NYC
and none of these conspicuous attacks on citizens is affecting
the ultimate path of drugs to the street.

As Strummer says: "they arrested every drug which had ever been made" --
but not he drug kingpin, who is protected by narcotics police officers.
And of course FBI/DEA.
In the UK as I expect elsewhere in the world the drug supplies are funded by very wealthy influential untouchables like those lazy wig wearing fuckers in the House of Lords. These bastards sit around discussing what's right and wrong fong for us all "sitting making laws all day" while funding drugs/terroism and all manner of evil shit. The police may pick up the man on the street/the supplier/other middle men but they can't touch the Lords and no one will ever get that far up the ladder.
The legislators of the various countries have made drugs illegal.
They have also allocated large amounts of tax money to pay police/DEA
to carry out drug laws.
For 50 years this problem has only become worse.
This means police are refusing to perform this drug enforcement properly.
That means the legislators need to perform oversight on exactly
how the police perform this role and spend their enormous budgets.

If there were the odd case of police brutality, but drugs were unavailable
in our cities, then there would not be an issue.
The job is not being done and everyone in government should be able to see that.

Silent Majority
Singer-Songwriter Nancy
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Re: Strummer ad-libs

Post by Silent Majority »

Silent Majority wrote:
15 Sep 2017, 1:04pm
Between the weed of his whole life, dabbles in trying heroin, a period of coke in the early to mid eighties and with the Groucho set, speed in the seventies, ecstasy in the mid to late nineties, I'd be surprised to learn their were many drugs that Strummer never flirted with.
Definitely LSD if you went uni as a hippy in the early 70s too.
a lifetime serving one machine
Is ten times worse than prison


www.pexlives.libsyn.com/

Dr. Medulla
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Re: Strummer ad-libs

Post by Dr. Medulla »

Silent Majority wrote:
15 Sep 2017, 1:50pm
Silent Majority wrote:
15 Sep 2017, 1:04pm
Between the weed of his whole life, dabbles in trying heroin, a period of coke in the early to mid eighties and with the Groucho set, speed in the seventies, ecstasy in the mid to late nineties, I'd be surprised to learn their were many drugs that Strummer never flirted with.
Definitely LSD if you went uni as a hippy in the early 70s too.
Joe was no puritan, so I wouldn't be surprised by any kind of hedonistic or experimental excesses he might have engaged in.
"I never doubted myself for a minute for I knew that my monkey-strong bowels were girded with strength, like the loins of a dragon ribboned with fat and the opulence of buffalo dung." - Richard Nixon, Checkers Speech, abandoned early draft

Aeneas
Dirty Punk
Posts: 67
Joined: 25 Oct 2015, 1:42am

Re: Strummer ad-libs

Post by Aeneas »

Silent Majority wrote:
15 Sep 2017, 1:04pm
Between the weed of his whole life, dabbles in trying heroin, a period of coke in the early to mid eighties and with the Groucho set, speed in the seventies, ecstasy in the mid to late nineties, I'd be surprised to learn their were many drugs that Strummer never flirted with.
Strummer is important here because he wrote lyrics which brought attention
to the beginnings of the drug war, and was forced to deal with a crisis
of drug usage by members of his own band, which led to the end of The Clash.
Drugs are bad, cause brain damage, regardless of whether Strummer
used spliffs or not -- ask Syd Barrett founder of Pink Floyd.

Marky Dread
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Messiah of the Milk Bar
Posts: 58888
Joined: 17 Jun 2008, 11:26am

Re: Strummer ad-libs

Post by Marky Dread »

Aeneas wrote:
15 Sep 2017, 1:58pm
Silent Majority wrote:
15 Sep 2017, 1:04pm
Between the weed of his whole life, dabbles in trying heroin, a period of coke in the early to mid eighties and with the Groucho set, speed in the seventies, ecstasy in the mid to late nineties, I'd be surprised to learn their were many drugs that Strummer never flirted with.
Strummer is important here because he wrote lyrics which brought attention
to the beginnings of the drug war, and was forced to deal with a crisis
of drug usage by members of his own band, which led to the end of The Clash.
Drugs are bad, cause brain damage, regardless of whether Strummer
used spliffs or not -- ask Syd Barrett founder of Pink Floyd.
Interesting as Joe loved the early Floyd "See Emily Play" being one his faves.
Image

Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty


We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.

"Without the common people you're nothing"

Nos Sumus Una Familia

Silent Majority
Singer-Songwriter Nancy
Posts: 18702
Joined: 10 Nov 2008, 8:28pm
Location: South Londoner in the Midlands.

Re: Strummer ad-libs

Post by Silent Majority »

Painkillers are bad. Just ask Philip Seymour Hoffman.
a lifetime serving one machine
Is ten times worse than prison


www.pexlives.libsyn.com/

Aeneas
Dirty Punk
Posts: 67
Joined: 25 Oct 2015, 1:42am

Re: Strummer ad-libs

Post by Aeneas »

Silent Majority wrote:
15 Sep 2017, 2:37pm
Painkillers are bad. Just ask Philip Seymour Hoffman.
Or Prince, Or Michael Jackson.
Yet few of the doctors who made the initial unnecessary opioid prescription
are going to prison.
Police/DEA simply are not doing their job.

Interestingly, on Seymour Hoffman, there was a consternation here
in the crooked Press on who his drug dealer was and that prompted
police to track down who the dealer was.
However, that is as far up the chain they were prepared to pursue,
and that story fizzled out before reaching the drug kingpin responsible.

Silent Majority
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Posts: 18702
Joined: 10 Nov 2008, 8:28pm
Location: South Londoner in the Midlands.

Re: Strummer ad-libs

Post by Silent Majority »

Well, I'm out of this thread for a bit.
a lifetime serving one machine
Is ten times worse than prison


www.pexlives.libsyn.com/

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