RAMONES

General music discussion.
Marky Dread
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Re: RAMONES

Post by Marky Dread » 04 Jan 2019, 11:44am

WestwayKid wrote:
04 Jan 2019, 11:17am
matedog wrote:
04 Jan 2019, 10:24am
Flex wrote:
04 Jan 2019, 1:32am
matedog wrote:
04 Jan 2019, 1:16am
Haven’t listened to much live Ramones. What’s the general consensus best place to start?
the king biscuit flower hour release is the fuckin' tits. recorded a week after it's alive and benefits from playing at the correct speed and no overdubs. great, great performance. it's alive is their second best live record. just such peak-era RAMONES.
My favorite footage is that German show from like 78.ill see if I can track down king biscuit.

I remember something about overdubs on Alive but was susrprised they didn’t mention it in that article.
I think that comment comes from Marky Ramone...who wasn't even in the band when it was recorded. He claims the entire album (except for the drums) was re-recorded in the studio.
I can't imagine Johnny wanting to do any overdubs. But who knows...Sounds fucking great!


Here's the King Biscuit archive.
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coffeepotman
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Re: RAMONES

Post by coffeepotman » 04 Jan 2019, 11:49am

That Live at the Rainbow fucking knocked me out when I first got the DVD, and if you're into the Ramones that DVD is essential.

As far as Live Ramones go, I'm particular to the Ritchie era, I think he killed it, too bad he got screwed out of the t shirt money. Check out if you can find it the Smash You Live 1985 CD or there are some good boots out the from 86 and Rome 89 with Dee Dee
Last edited by coffeepotman on 04 Jan 2019, 11:57am, edited 1 time in total.

WestwayKid
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Re: RAMONES

Post by WestwayKid » 04 Jan 2019, 11:57am

I was just listening to a handful of It's Alive/NYC 1978 tracks side-by-side and It's Alive definitely sounds crisper - especially in regards to Johnny's guitar playing. He sounds a bit more ragged and out-of-tune on NYC 1978 - but it doesn't detract from the performance. Honestly, the sound of the Ramones playing "live" in the studio versus live on stage probably isn't that much. The studio might have allowed them the time to make sure they were in tune and to clean up flubbed notes and so on - but it still sounds (in my opinion) live. They're both simply fantastic recordings. Have some chicken vindaloo and enjoy!! :mrgreen:
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Marky Dread
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Re: RAMONES

Post by Marky Dread » 04 Jan 2019, 12:07pm

WestwayKid wrote:
04 Jan 2019, 11:57am
I was just listening to a handful of It's Alive/NYC 1978 tracks side-by-side and It's Alive definitely sounds crisper - especially in regards to Johnny's guitar playing. He sounds a bit more ragged and out-of-tune on NYC 1978 - but it doesn't detract from the performance. Honestly, the sound of the Ramones playing "live" in the studio versus live on stage probably isn't that much. The studio might have allowed them the time to make sure they were in tune and to clean up flubbed notes and so on - but it still sounds (in my opinion) live. They're both simply fantastic recordings. Have some chicken vindaloo and enjoy!! :mrgreen:
Marky theory : "It's Alive" was recorded on the Basing Street Mobile Truck from Island Records. With it's state of the art Helios console theses consoles were built between '69 - '79 and fewer than 50 were made. Led Zep used one to record Stairway to Heaven. Now "It's Alive" was being recorded for a live album and the NY show was recorded for radio only. That's a big difference right there with the mixing.

https://www.historyofrecording.com/Heli ... soles.html
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WestwayKid
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Re: RAMONES

Post by WestwayKid » 04 Jan 2019, 12:18pm

Marky Dread wrote:
04 Jan 2019, 12:07pm
WestwayKid wrote:
04 Jan 2019, 11:57am
I was just listening to a handful of It's Alive/NYC 1978 tracks side-by-side and It's Alive definitely sounds crisper - especially in regards to Johnny's guitar playing. He sounds a bit more ragged and out-of-tune on NYC 1978 - but it doesn't detract from the performance. Honestly, the sound of the Ramones playing "live" in the studio versus live on stage probably isn't that much. The studio might have allowed them the time to make sure they were in tune and to clean up flubbed notes and so on - but it still sounds (in my opinion) live. They're both simply fantastic recordings. Have some chicken vindaloo and enjoy!! :mrgreen:
Marky theory : "It's Alive" was recorded on the Basing Street Mobile Truck from Island Records. With it's state of the art Helios console theses consoles were built between '69 - '79 and fewer than 50 were made. Led Zep used one to record Stairway to Heaven. Now "It's Alive" was being recorded for a live album and the NY show was recorded for radio only. That's a big difference right there with the mixing.

https://www.historyofrecording.com/Heli ... soles.html
Very interesting stuff!

Another thing worth mentioning is that It's Alive was produced by Tommy Ramone and Ed Stasium...and mixed by Stasium. The King Biscuit set was mixed by Glen Robinson. I don't know a lot about him - but that might also account for some of the audio differences.
"If they believed in a place called Kokomo, then so did I." - Michael Edward Love

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Re: RAMONES

Post by WestwayKid » 06 Jan 2019, 12:55pm

I'm going back and forth on the 40th anniversary sets. I'm already swimming in Ramones discs (I have all of the original CD's and then all of the expanded/remastered discs). The extra tracks alone might be enough to sway me - but really it's going to come down to the sound of the original albums. Is the sound that much better than what Rhino put out back in 2001/2002? Is there enough difference that it's going to really change how I've heard these albums up until now? Thinking about the Clash remasters from 1999 - which I didn't think sounded very good. The 2013 Sound System remasters were way better and they did change how I heard the music - so in my mind - that was a worthy investment.
"If they believed in a place called Kokomo, then so did I." - Michael Edward Love

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Re: RAMONES

Post by matedog » 07 Jan 2019, 12:03pm

Randomly gave Pleasant Dreams some plays this weekend and really dug it. I was already very familiar with Sensation and KKK, but "Don't Go" and "You Sound Like You're Sick" and a bunch others had great hooks. The first four albums get all the attention, but there's a lot of gems in their other albums.
Look, you have to establish context for these things. And I maintain that unless you appreciate the Fall of Constantinople, the Great Fire of London, and Mickey Mantle's fatalist alcoholism, live Freddy makes no sense. If you want to half-ass it, fine, go call Simon Schama to do the appendix.

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Re: RAMONES

Post by matedog » 07 Jan 2019, 12:06pm

matedog wrote:
07 Jan 2019, 12:03pm
Randomly gave Pleasant Dreams some plays this weekend and really dug it. I was already very familiar with Sensation and KKK, but "Don't Go" and "You Sound Like You're Sick" and a bunch others had great hooks. The first four albums get all the attention, but there's a lot of gems in their other albums.
Well shit: viewtopic.php?f=11&t=4833&p=264990&hili ... ms#p264958
Look, you have to establish context for these things. And I maintain that unless you appreciate the Fall of Constantinople, the Great Fire of London, and Mickey Mantle's fatalist alcoholism, live Freddy makes no sense. If you want to half-ass it, fine, go call Simon Schama to do the appendix.

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Re: RAMONES

Post by WestwayKid » 07 Jan 2019, 12:34pm

matedog wrote:
07 Jan 2019, 12:06pm
matedog wrote:
07 Jan 2019, 12:03pm
Randomly gave Pleasant Dreams some plays this weekend and really dug it. I was already very familiar with Sensation and KKK, but "Don't Go" and "You Sound Like You're Sick" and a bunch others had great hooks. The first four albums get all the attention, but there's a lot of gems in their other albums.
Well shit: viewtopic.php?f=11&t=4833&p=264990&hili ... ms#p264958
Pleasant Dreams is sort of a lost classic in my opinion. I'd even place it ahead of fan fave Too Tough to Die if I were ranking their albums. I don't think Graham Gouldman was the right producer for them - but they somehow made an enjoyable together.
"If they believed in a place called Kokomo, then so did I." - Michael Edward Love

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Re: RAMONES

Post by Marky Dread » 07 Jan 2019, 4:24pm

WestwayKid wrote:
07 Jan 2019, 12:34pm
matedog wrote:
07 Jan 2019, 12:06pm
matedog wrote:
07 Jan 2019, 12:03pm
Randomly gave Pleasant Dreams some plays this weekend and really dug it. I was already very familiar with Sensation and KKK, but "Don't Go" and "You Sound Like You're Sick" and a bunch others had great hooks. The first four albums get all the attention, but there's a lot of gems in their other albums.
Well shit: viewtopic.php?f=11&t=4833&p=264990&hili ... ms#p264958
Pleasant Dreams is sort of a lost classic in my opinion. I'd even place it ahead of fan fave Too Tough to Die if I were ranking their albums. I don't think Graham Gouldman was the right producer for them - but they somehow made an enjoyable together.
I think it's great and some producers work better than others of course. But then the RAMONES were not just 1234 go they were sixties bubblegum pop with elements of glam. Fuck every time I talk about them it makes me realise just how much I miss them.
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Re: RAMONES

Post by WestwayKid » 07 Jan 2019, 4:38pm

Marky Dread wrote:
07 Jan 2019, 4:24pm
WestwayKid wrote:
07 Jan 2019, 12:34pm
matedog wrote:
07 Jan 2019, 12:06pm
matedog wrote:
07 Jan 2019, 12:03pm
Randomly gave Pleasant Dreams some plays this weekend and really dug it. I was already very familiar with Sensation and KKK, but "Don't Go" and "You Sound Like You're Sick" and a bunch others had great hooks. The first four albums get all the attention, but there's a lot of gems in their other albums.
Well shit: viewtopic.php?f=11&t=4833&p=264990&hili ... ms#p264958
Pleasant Dreams is sort of a lost classic in my opinion. I'd even place it ahead of fan fave Too Tough to Die if I were ranking their albums. I don't think Graham Gouldman was the right producer for them - but they somehow made an enjoyable together.
I think it's great and some producers work better than others of course. But then the RAMONES were not just 1234 go they were sixties bubblegum pop with elements of glam. Fuck every time I talk about them it makes me realise just how much I miss them.
I gave it a spin today after Matey mentioned it - and there really isn't a bad track on it. It feels like a natural progression from Road to Ruin (as does End of the Century, for that matter) - the "classic" sound is still there - but there is also a lot of bubblegum, girl group, and pop thrown into the mix. Subterranean Jungle has always been more difficult for me - there is something about the sound that doesn't quite hook me. The first 4 albums are unimpeachable - but there is some really good stuff in the second half of their discography if one is willing to put in the time.
"If they believed in a place called Kokomo, then so did I." - Michael Edward Love

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Re: RAMONES

Post by Marky Dread » 07 Jan 2019, 5:04pm

WestwayKid wrote:
07 Jan 2019, 4:38pm
Marky Dread wrote:
07 Jan 2019, 4:24pm
WestwayKid wrote:
07 Jan 2019, 12:34pm
matedog wrote:
07 Jan 2019, 12:06pm
matedog wrote:
07 Jan 2019, 12:03pm
Randomly gave Pleasant Dreams some plays this weekend and really dug it. I was already very familiar with Sensation and KKK, but "Don't Go" and "You Sound Like You're Sick" and a bunch others had great hooks. The first four albums get all the attention, but there's a lot of gems in their other albums.
Well shit: viewtopic.php?f=11&t=4833&p=264990&hili ... ms#p264958
Pleasant Dreams is sort of a lost classic in my opinion. I'd even place it ahead of fan fave Too Tough to Die if I were ranking their albums. I don't think Graham Gouldman was the right producer for them - but they somehow made an enjoyable together.
I think it's great and some producers work better than others of course. But then the RAMONES were not just 1234 go they were sixties bubblegum pop with elements of glam. Fuck every time I talk about them it makes me realise just how much I miss them.
I gave it a spin today after Matey mentioned it - and there really isn't a bad track on it. It feels like a natural progression from Road to Ruin (as does End of the Century, for that matter) - the "classic" sound is still there - but there is also a lot of bubblegum, girl group, and pop thrown into the mix. Subterranean Jungle has always been more difficult for me - there is something about the sound that doesn't quite hook me. The first 4 albums are unimpeachable - but there is some really good stuff in the second half of their discography if one is willing to put in the time.
I like all their albums. There are some great tracks on SJ Psycho Therapy, Highest Trails Above, Outsider. I love their cover of Liitle Bit O' Soul.
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WestwayKid
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Re: RAMONES

Post by WestwayKid » 07 Jan 2019, 5:24pm

Marky Dread wrote:
07 Jan 2019, 5:04pm
WestwayKid wrote:
07 Jan 2019, 4:38pm
Marky Dread wrote:
07 Jan 2019, 4:24pm
WestwayKid wrote:
07 Jan 2019, 12:34pm
Pleasant Dreams is sort of a lost classic in my opinion. I'd even place it ahead of fan fave Too Tough to Die if I were ranking their albums. I don't think Graham Gouldman was the right producer for them - but they somehow made an enjoyable together.
I think it's great and some producers work better than others of course. But then the RAMONES were not just 1234 go they were sixties bubblegum pop with elements of glam. Fuck every time I talk about them it makes me realise just how much I miss them.
I gave it a spin today after Matey mentioned it - and there really isn't a bad track on it. It feels like a natural progression from Road to Ruin (as does End of the Century, for that matter) - the "classic" sound is still there - but there is also a lot of bubblegum, girl group, and pop thrown into the mix. Subterranean Jungle has always been more difficult for me - there is something about the sound that doesn't quite hook me. The first 4 albums are unimpeachable - but there is some really good stuff in the second half of their discography if one is willing to put in the time.
I like all their albums. There are some great tracks on SJ Psycho Therapy, Highest Trails Above, Outsider. I love their cover of Liitle Bit O' Soul.
I've grown into being a pretty big fan of Halfway to Sanity.
"If they believed in a place called Kokomo, then so did I." - Michael Edward Love

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Re: RAMONES

Post by Silent Majority » 07 Jan 2019, 5:27pm

Marky Dread wrote:
07 Jan 2019, 5:04pm
WestwayKid wrote:
07 Jan 2019, 4:38pm
Marky Dread wrote:
07 Jan 2019, 4:24pm
WestwayKid wrote:
07 Jan 2019, 12:34pm
Pleasant Dreams is sort of a lost classic in my opinion. I'd even place it ahead of fan fave Too Tough to Die if I were ranking their albums. I don't think Graham Gouldman was the right producer for them - but they somehow made an enjoyable together.
I think it's great and some producers work better than others of course. But then the RAMONES were not just 1234 go they were sixties bubblegum pop with elements of glam. Fuck every time I talk about them it makes me realise just how much I miss them.
I gave it a spin today after Matey mentioned it - and there really isn't a bad track on it. It feels like a natural progression from Road to Ruin (as does End of the Century, for that matter) - the "classic" sound is still there - but there is also a lot of bubblegum, girl group, and pop thrown into the mix. Subterranean Jungle has always been more difficult for me - there is something about the sound that doesn't quite hook me. The first 4 albums are unimpeachable - but there is some really good stuff in the second half of their discography if one is willing to put in the time.
I like all their albums. There are some great tracks on SJ Psycho Therapy, Highest Trails Above, Outsider. I love their cover of Liitle Bit O' Soul.
Highest Trails Above is a lost goddamn classic.
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matedog
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Re: RAMONES

Post by matedog » 07 Jan 2019, 5:31pm

Marky Dread wrote:
07 Jan 2019, 5:04pm
WestwayKid wrote:
07 Jan 2019, 4:38pm
Marky Dread wrote:
07 Jan 2019, 4:24pm
WestwayKid wrote:
07 Jan 2019, 12:34pm
Pleasant Dreams is sort of a lost classic in my opinion. I'd even place it ahead of fan fave Too Tough to Die if I were ranking their albums. I don't think Graham Gouldman was the right producer for them - but they somehow made an enjoyable together.
I think it's great and some producers work better than others of course. But then the RAMONES were not just 1234 go they were sixties bubblegum pop with elements of glam. Fuck every time I talk about them it makes me realise just how much I miss them.
I gave it a spin today after Matey mentioned it - and there really isn't a bad track on it. It feels like a natural progression from Road to Ruin (as does End of the Century, for that matter) - the "classic" sound is still there - but there is also a lot of bubblegum, girl group, and pop thrown into the mix. Subterranean Jungle has always been more difficult for me - there is something about the sound that doesn't quite hook me. The first 4 albums are unimpeachable - but there is some really good stuff in the second half of their discography if one is willing to put in the time.
I like all their albums. There are some great tracks on SJ Psycho Therapy, Highest Trails Above, Outsider. I love their cover of Liitle Bit O' Soul.
Weird, I thought Little Bit O'Soul was an Equals original.I have some big gaps in my music knowledge.
Look, you have to establish context for these things. And I maintain that unless you appreciate the Fall of Constantinople, the Great Fire of London, and Mickey Mantle's fatalist alcoholism, live Freddy makes no sense. If you want to half-ass it, fine, go call Simon Schama to do the appendix.

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