Music opinion/question of the week...

General music discussion.
WestwayKid
User avatar
Unknown Immortal
Posts: 6704
Joined: 20 Sep 2017, 8:22am
Location: Mill-e-wah-que

Re: Music opinion/question of the week...

Post by WestwayKid »

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/13/arts ... n-sex.html

Deeply disturbing. I am a big Ryan Adams fan. His music has helped me get through some really bad times. I'm not shocked (sadly). He has a reputation for being narcissistic and obnoxious and so on - but he's gotten a pass (largely) because he was so talented. The article also mentions how music has largely avoided the #MeToo movement because that sort of behavior has long been accepted as part of the deal. I would guarantee that Gene Simmons has done worse than Ryan Adams and that's not to defend Adams at all - just a point made to highlight how ingrained it is within rock history. Personally, I find this type of behavior to be disgusting - using a position of power to hurt people - whether it's Ryan Adams "sexting" with a 14-year-old girl or Jimmy Page and a bunch of teenage groupies back in the 1970's and I'm hopeful that maybe this article breaks all of this open within music. That said - it's still hard when a musician/artist you really care about is exposed for being a real piece of crap.
"They don't think it be like it is, but it do." - Oscar Gamble

Flex
User avatar
Mechano-Man of the Future
Posts: 35802
Joined: 15 Jun 2008, 2:50pm
Location: The Information Superhighway!

Re: Music opinion/question of the week...

Post by Flex »

WestwayKid wrote:
14 Feb 2019, 9:33am
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/13/arts ... n-sex.html

Deeply disturbing. I am a big Ryan Adams fan. His music has helped me get through some really bad times. I'm not shocked (sadly). He has a reputation for being narcissistic and obnoxious and so on - but he's gotten a pass (largely) because he was so talented. The article also mentions how music has largely avoided the #MeToo movement because that sort of behavior has long been accepted as part of the deal. I would guarantee that Gene Simmons has done worse than Ryan Adams and that's not to defend Adams at all - just a point made to highlight how ingrained it is within rock history. Personally, I find this type of behavior to be disgusting - using a position of power to hurt people - whether it's Ryan Adams "sexting" with a 14-year-old girl or Jimmy Page and a bunch of teenage groupies back in the 1970's and I'm hopeful that maybe this article breaks all of this open within music. That said - it's still hard when a musician/artist you really care about is exposed for being a real piece of crap.
Ah, shit.
Wiggle, wiggle, wiggle like a bowl of soup
Wiggle, wiggle, wiggle like a rolling hoop
Wiggle, wiggle, wiggle like a ton of lead
Wiggle - you can raise the dead

Pex Lives!

WestwayKid
User avatar
Unknown Immortal
Posts: 6704
Joined: 20 Sep 2017, 8:22am
Location: Mill-e-wah-que

Re: Music opinion/question of the week...

Post by WestwayKid »

Flex wrote:
14 Feb 2019, 10:41am
WestwayKid wrote:
14 Feb 2019, 9:33am
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/13/arts ... n-sex.html

Deeply disturbing. I am a big Ryan Adams fan. His music has helped me get through some really bad times. I'm not shocked (sadly). He has a reputation for being narcissistic and obnoxious and so on - but he's gotten a pass (largely) because he was so talented. The article also mentions how music has largely avoided the #MeToo movement because that sort of behavior has long been accepted as part of the deal. I would guarantee that Gene Simmons has done worse than Ryan Adams and that's not to defend Adams at all - just a point made to highlight how ingrained it is within rock history. Personally, I find this type of behavior to be disgusting - using a position of power to hurt people - whether it's Ryan Adams "sexting" with a 14-year-old girl or Jimmy Page and a bunch of teenage groupies back in the 1970's and I'm hopeful that maybe this article breaks all of this open within music. That said - it's still hard when a musician/artist you really care about is exposed for being a real piece of crap.
Ah, shit.
It will be interesting to see how this all plays out on several levels. It feels like this sort of behavior has been tolerated in music for too long. Somewhat selfishly - it does make me sad that Adams had to be involved. I really am a big fan of his music - even if I've always found him to be pretentious and obnoxious. His music really had helped me get through some really, really bad times. That said - I can't ignore the fact that he's allegedly done some really terrible stuff.
"They don't think it be like it is, but it do." - Oscar Gamble

Dr. Medulla
User avatar
Atheistic Epileptic
Posts: 115992
Joined: 15 Jun 2008, 2:00pm
Location: Straight Banana, Idaho

Re: Music opinion/question of the week...

Post by Dr. Medulla »

WestwayKid wrote:
14 Feb 2019, 9:33am
it's still hard when a musician/artist you really care about is exposed for being a real piece of crap.
We'd all be happier if we knew less about musicians, athletes, etc. Or that we not form any kind of emotional attachment to them.
"I never doubted myself for a minute for I knew that my monkey-strong bowels were girded with strength, like the loins of a dragon ribboned with fat and the opulence of buffalo dung." - Richard Nixon, Checkers Speech, abandoned early draft

WestwayKid
User avatar
Unknown Immortal
Posts: 6704
Joined: 20 Sep 2017, 8:22am
Location: Mill-e-wah-que

Re: Music opinion/question of the week...

Post by WestwayKid »

Dr. Medulla wrote:
14 Feb 2019, 11:39am
WestwayKid wrote:
14 Feb 2019, 9:33am
it's still hard when a musician/artist you really care about is exposed for being a real piece of crap.
We'd all be happier if we knew less about musicians, athletes, etc. Or that we not form any kind of emotional attachment to them.
Very true. I think we all (I hope) understand that the musicians, athletes and so on that we admire are human - they have faults (some bigger than others) and it becomes a balancing act - how much do we separate the artist from the art and can we ever fully do that?
"They don't think it be like it is, but it do." - Oscar Gamble

JennyB
User avatar
Mossad Van Driver
Posts: 22257
Joined: 16 Jun 2008, 1:13pm
Location: Moranjortsville

Re: Music opinion/question of the week...

Post by JennyB »

WestwayKid wrote:
14 Feb 2019, 9:33am
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/13/arts ... n-sex.html

Deeply disturbing. I am a big Ryan Adams fan. His music has helped me get through some really bad times. I'm not shocked (sadly). He has a reputation for being narcissistic and obnoxious and so on - but he's gotten a pass (largely) because he was so talented. The article also mentions how music has largely avoided the #MeToo movement because that sort of behavior has long been accepted as part of the deal. I would guarantee that Gene Simmons has done worse than Ryan Adams and that's not to defend Adams at all - just a point made to highlight how ingrained it is within rock history. Personally, I find this type of behavior to be disgusting - using a position of power to hurt people - whether it's Ryan Adams "sexting" with a 14-year-old girl or Jimmy Page and a bunch of teenage groupies back in the 1970's and I'm hopeful that maybe this article breaks all of this open within music. That said - it's still hard when a musician/artist you really care about is exposed for being a real piece of crap.
It's very hard. So many of the musicians we love are awful, awful people.
Got a Rake? Sure!

IMCT: Inane Middle-Class Twats - Dr. M

" *sigh* it's right when they throw the penis pump out the window." -Hoy

Marky Dread
User avatar
Messiah of the Milk Bar
Posts: 58887
Joined: 17 Jun 2008, 11:26am

Re: Music opinion/question of the week...

Post by Marky Dread »

WestwayKid wrote:
14 Feb 2019, 12:23pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
14 Feb 2019, 11:39am
WestwayKid wrote:
14 Feb 2019, 9:33am
it's still hard when a musician/artist you really care about is exposed for being a real piece of crap.
We'd all be happier if we knew less about musicians, athletes, etc. Or that we not form any kind of emotional attachment to them.
Very true. I think we all (I hope) understand that the musicians, athletes and so on that we admire are human - they have faults (some bigger than others) and it becomes a balancing act - how much do we separate the artist from the art and can we ever fully do that?
I'm interested to see how this case pans out. I not suggesting he is innocent but he's hardly been found guilty of anything either. I am always suspect when these things rear their head after a long period of time. Media attention brings this stuff to the surface but it's not always through honest intentions.
Image

Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty


We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.

"Without the common people you're nothing"

Nos Sumus Una Familia

WestwayKid
User avatar
Unknown Immortal
Posts: 6704
Joined: 20 Sep 2017, 8:22am
Location: Mill-e-wah-que

Re: Music opinion/question of the week...

Post by WestwayKid »

Social media is awash today with music critics and fans who are now saying they never thought Ryan Adams was that talented and so on. They're also the same critics who would never have had time for someone like Mandy Moore - but they're now holding her up as an incredible talent (and no knock on her - she is talented). I just really dislike the knee jerk reactions of the music press. These are the same people who in reality have been swooning over Ryan Adams for nearly 20 years - thereby helping to create the pretentious monster that is Ryan Adams. I get it. The guy is a creep and he's been disgraced - but it's also okay to admit that you liked his music. Admitting that you liked his music doesn't make you guilty by association. It just seems far more legit to say hey, I liked him - but I can't support him anymore. I'm not shocked because revisionism goes hand in hand with music critics - but still...
"They don't think it be like it is, but it do." - Oscar Gamble

drowninghere
Long Time Jerk
Posts: 775
Joined: 28 Jun 2008, 1:19am

Re: Music opinion/question of the week...

Post by drowninghere »

WestwayKid wrote:
14 Feb 2019, 9:33am
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/13/arts ... n-sex.html

Deeply disturbing. I am a big Ryan Adams fan. His music has helped me get through some really bad times. I'm not shocked (sadly). He has a reputation for being narcissistic and obnoxious and so on - but he's gotten a pass (largely) because he was so talented. The article also mentions how music has largely avoided the #MeToo movement because that sort of behavior has long been accepted as part of the deal. I would guarantee that Gene Simmons has done worse than Ryan Adams and that's not to defend Adams at all - just a point made to highlight how ingrained it is within rock history. Personally, I find this type of behavior to be disgusting - using a position of power to hurt people - whether it's Ryan Adams "sexting" with a 14-year-old girl or Jimmy Page and a bunch of teenage groupies back in the 1970's and I'm hopeful that maybe this article breaks all of this open within music. That said - it's still hard when a musician/artist you really care about is exposed for being a real piece of crap.
Surprised and proud to see Phoebe Bridgers in the article - takes a lot of courage to speak up. Anyways, she is a star, and probably worth more of your time in 2019 than Ryan Adams.



WestwayKid
User avatar
Unknown Immortal
Posts: 6704
Joined: 20 Sep 2017, 8:22am
Location: Mill-e-wah-que

Re: Music opinion/question of the week...

Post by WestwayKid »

drowninghere wrote:
15 Feb 2019, 10:38am
WestwayKid wrote:
14 Feb 2019, 9:33am
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/13/arts ... n-sex.html

Deeply disturbing. I am a big Ryan Adams fan. His music has helped me get through some really bad times. I'm not shocked (sadly). He has a reputation for being narcissistic and obnoxious and so on - but he's gotten a pass (largely) because he was so talented. The article also mentions how music has largely avoided the #MeToo movement because that sort of behavior has long been accepted as part of the deal. I would guarantee that Gene Simmons has done worse than Ryan Adams and that's not to defend Adams at all - just a point made to highlight how ingrained it is within rock history. Personally, I find this type of behavior to be disgusting - using a position of power to hurt people - whether it's Ryan Adams "sexting" with a 14-year-old girl or Jimmy Page and a bunch of teenage groupies back in the 1970's and I'm hopeful that maybe this article breaks all of this open within music. That said - it's still hard when a musician/artist you really care about is exposed for being a real piece of crap.
Surprised and proud to see Phoebe Bridgers in the article - takes a lot of courage to speak up. Anyways, she is a star, and probably worth more of your time in 2019 than Ryan Adams.


I really like the album she did with Conor Oberst. It is really fantastic.
"They don't think it be like it is, but it do." - Oscar Gamble

Marky Dread
User avatar
Messiah of the Milk Bar
Posts: 58887
Joined: 17 Jun 2008, 11:26am

Re: Music opinion/question of the week...

Post by Marky Dread »

WestwayKid wrote:
15 Feb 2019, 10:06am
Social media is awash today with music critics and fans who are now saying they never thought Ryan Adams was that talented and so on. They're also the same critics who would never have had time for someone like Mandy Moore - but they're now holding her up as an incredible talent (and no knock on her - she is talented). I just really dislike the knee jerk reactions of the music press. These are the same people who in reality have been swooning over Ryan Adams for nearly 20 years - thereby helping to create the pretentious monster that is Ryan Adams. I get it. The guy is a creep and he's been disgraced - but it's also okay to admit that you liked his music. Admitting that you liked his music doesn't make you guilty by association. It just seems far more legit to say hey, I liked him - but I can't support him anymore. I'm not shocked because revisionism goes hand in hand with music critics - but still...
The music critics are so full of bullshit they just don't want to be seen as being on the wrong side. If Adams is guilty and I'm not suggesting he isn't it wouldn't stop me listening to some of his music and still thinking it's great. I have no problem in separating the artist from their music. If you bought a nice house that you loved would you knock it down becuase you found out it was built by a rapist or murderer. People are and can be terrible that's nothing new. Why should we expect musicains to be anything other than terrible people too.
Image

Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty


We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.

"Without the common people you're nothing"

Nos Sumus Una Familia

WestwayKid
User avatar
Unknown Immortal
Posts: 6704
Joined: 20 Sep 2017, 8:22am
Location: Mill-e-wah-que

Re: Music opinion/question of the week...

Post by WestwayKid »

It does raise the question of can we separate the artist from the art and should we even if we could?
"They don't think it be like it is, but it do." - Oscar Gamble

Marky Dread
User avatar
Messiah of the Milk Bar
Posts: 58887
Joined: 17 Jun 2008, 11:26am

Re: Music opinion/question of the week...

Post by Marky Dread »

WestwayKid wrote:
15 Feb 2019, 11:48am
It does raise the question of can we separate the artist from the art and should we even if we could?
Okay each to his own on this but I have no problem liking music made some bloody terrible people. Gary Glitter is a classic example to me an absolute disgrace of a human being. However I'm not going into denial to say I don't enjoy those classic 70s singles. Besides he was the vocalists and there was a whole band of musicians who made those songs why should they suffer from people boycotting the sales of stuff they worked hard on. I'm certain they have famillies to feed as well.

Look at all the debauchery that has gone on in the name of Rock 'n' Roll. So no more Chuck Berry/Jerry Lee Lewis/Led Zeppelin/Sex Pistols the list of greats goes on forever.
Image

Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty


We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.

"Without the common people you're nothing"

Nos Sumus Una Familia

Heston
User avatar
God of Thunder...and Rock 'n Roll
Posts: 38356
Joined: 15 Jun 2008, 4:07pm
Location: North of Watford Junction

Re: Music opinion/question of the week...

Post by Heston »

Marky Dread wrote:
15 Feb 2019, 12:03pm
WestwayKid wrote:
15 Feb 2019, 11:48am
It does raise the question of can we separate the artist from the art and should we even if we could?
Okay each to his own on this but I have no problem liking music made some bloody terrible people. Gary Glitter is a classic example to me an absolute disgrace of a human being. However I'm not going into denial to say I don't enjoy those classic 70s singles. Besides he was the vocalists and there was a whole band of musicians who made those songs why should they suffer from people boycotting the sales of stuff they worked hard on. I'm certain they have famillies to feed as well.

Look at all the debauchery that has gone on in the name of Rock 'n' Roll. So no more Chuck Berry/Jerry Lee Lewis/Led Zeppelin/Sex Pistols the list of greats goes on forever.
This is generally my opinion but there are some whose crimes are so heinous that I don't think they should ever be played on tv or radio. Lost Prophets and Gary Glitter spring to mind.
There's a tiny, tiny hopeful part of me that says you guys are running a Kaufmanesque long con on the board

Marky Dread
User avatar
Messiah of the Milk Bar
Posts: 58887
Joined: 17 Jun 2008, 11:26am

Re: Music opinion/question of the week...

Post by Marky Dread »

Heston wrote:
15 Feb 2019, 12:09pm
Marky Dread wrote:
15 Feb 2019, 12:03pm
WestwayKid wrote:
15 Feb 2019, 11:48am
It does raise the question of can we separate the artist from the art and should we even if we could?
Okay each to his own on this but I have no problem liking music made some bloody terrible people. Gary Glitter is a classic example to me an absolute disgrace of a human being. However I'm not going into denial to say I don't enjoy those classic 70s singles. Besides he was the vocalists and there was a whole band of musicians who made those songs why should they suffer from people boycotting the sales of stuff they worked hard on. I'm certain they have famillies to feed as well.

Look at all the debauchery that has gone on in the name of Rock 'n' Roll. So no more Chuck Berry/Jerry Lee Lewis/Led Zeppelin/Sex Pistols the list of greats goes on forever.
This is generally my opinion but there are some whose crimes are so heinous that I don't think they should ever be played on tv or radio. Lost Prophets and Gary Glitter spring to mind.
I'm not saying you are wrong but where do you draw a line in the sand.? There must be hundreds probably thousands of songs you like by people who have done some awful crimes. ;)
Image

Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty


We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.

"Without the common people you're nothing"

Nos Sumus Una Familia

Post Reply