Does anyone think Spotify/streaming will ever die out?

[Guest1]

Keep in mind, Spotify is a company that has been around for a decade now but has yet to turn a profit. They can't keep securing streaming rights forever. My expectation is that individual labels and artists may also get wise to streaming and start their own services, similar to disney plus. My hope is that Artists and other creators unionize somehow to get a fair due. It's incredibly funny in retrospect. Lars Ulrich got such a mountain of shit for attacking Napster but he was incredibly prophetic in the mess it would eventually lead to for musicians.

I use Spotify on occasion to discover new music but have always much preferred having CD's ripped to my hard drive. Something about the streaming platform seems incredibly ephemeral to me. Like the Library of Alexandria before it got burnt to a cinder.
There is also such a wealth of cheap MP3 players available these days. You can literally buy a portable 1 Terabyte (that's a metric fucktonne of music) device that will only set you back about 200. Remember how much they used to charge for IPods? Anyways, enough of me rambling on. Just curious to hear your opinion on the whole matter.

[Low Down Low]

From my very limited understanding, the big problem isn't the streaming companies per se, but the record companies and their failure/refusal to pass on a larger share of the fees to the artists. Maybe someone can correct me on that. It's an absolute scandal, regardless.

As for streaming, I can't see how it's not going to keep growing. It's just too practical and convenient. I'm conscious of artists getting stitched up in the transaction, but then I did literally purchase 1000s of cds when they were way overpriced so I feel I at least paid some dues there. Don't have the disposable income to be buying many cds now, outside of the handful of bands and artists for whom owning the physical product remains essential for me.

[Dr. Medulla]

They'll eventually make the system even worse, going to paywalls and more limited selection, none of which will benefit artist or consumer. Back when scrambling to counter P2P, a huge reason—maybe the biggest—that Steve Jobs was able to swoop in and sell the iTunes Store was that all the big record companies were dicking around and seeking their own proprietary system, so Sony only plays on devices set up for Sony, Warners on Warners, etc. A complete mess driven by an obsession with control and hostility to their own customers. For the same reason why the industry hated radio and MTV (at first)—they're stealing our content!—is why they'll want to subscription paywall everything. Whatever money they make from Spotify et al, all those companies resent the fuck that the consumer can hear a song and not pay anything. Time and again, the music industry looks at every golden goose and reaches for a hatchet.

[matedog]

Keep in mind, Spotify is a company that has been around for a decade now but has yet to turn a profit. They can't keep securing streaming rights forever. My expectation is that individual labels and artists may also get wise to streaming and start their own services, similar to disney plus. My hope is that Artists and other creators unionize somehow to get a fair due. It's incredibly funny in retrospect. Lars Ulrich got such a mountain of shit for attacking Napster but he was incredibly prophetic in the mess it would eventually lead to for musicians.

Fuck, that's going to suck, but that's gotta be where this goes.

[Low Down Low]

I dunno, would seem to me there's a limit to how much the vultures can extract from this. Squeeze too hard and people will simply say, fuck it, I'll get it on you tube or any of the other myriad platforms on which they can access free music. Though, all those mega artists flogging their back catalogues for eye popping sums definitely seem to be getting the good end of those deals from what I can glean about it.

[Low Down Low]

Like, if you're comparing it to how the video streaming networks have all branched out, I'm not sure how that'd work. Up to a couple of years ago, I had all my sporting needs pretty much met by the one subscription channel, 95% covered roughly. Now, some of its gone to BT, some to Amazon and more to some place else. No way in hell, I'm taking out 3 or more subs just to fill the gap that was left, still have the original sub and I'll drop that if it loses any more of what I want to watch. I'll just do without.

[Kory]

Like, if you're comparing it to how the video streaming networks have all branched out, I'm not sure how that'd work. Up to a couple of years ago, I had all my sporting needs pretty much met by the one subscription channel, 95% covered roughly. Now, some of its gone to BT, some to Amazon and more to some place else. No way in hell, I'm taking out 3 or more subs just to fill the gap that was left, still have the original sub and I'll drop that if it loses any more of what I want to watch. I'll just do without.

I tend to agree with this. If streaming becomes too difficult for users, either through increased paywalls or multiple new streamers split up by label, we're all just going to go back to Soulseek or whatever.

[Dr. Medulla]

Like, if you're comparing it to how the video streaming networks have all branched out, I'm not sure how that'd work. Up to a couple of years ago, I had all my sporting needs pretty much met by the one subscription channel, 95% covered roughly. Now, some of its gone to BT, some to Amazon and more to some place else. No way in hell, I'm taking out 3 or more subs just to fill the gap that was left, still have the original sub and I'll drop that if it loses any more of what I want to watch. I'll just do without.

I tend to agree with this. If streaming becomes too difficult for users, either through increased paywalls or multiple new streamers split up by label, we're all just going to go back to Soulseek or whatever.

And that's what the industry doesn't get. Streaming's great asset is accessibility and choice. Once they close that down—and they will—people will go back to pirating. Pirating is the base line; if they can't be more attractive than it, they'll lose listeners.

[matedog]

Like, if you're comparing it to how the video streaming networks have all branched out, I'm not sure how that'd work. Up to a couple of years ago, I had all my sporting needs pretty much met by the one subscription channel, 95% covered roughly. Now, some of its gone to BT, some to Amazon and more to some place else. No way in hell, I'm taking out 3 or more subs just to fill the gap that was left, still have the original sub and I'll drop that if it loses any more of what I want to watch. I'll just do without.

I tend to agree with this. If streaming becomes too difficult for users, either through increased paywalls or multiple new streamers split up by label, we're all just going to go back to Soulseek or whatever.

And that's what the industry doesn't get. Streaming's great asset is accessibility and choice. Once they close that down—and they will—people will go back to pirating. Pirating is the base line; if they can't be more attractive than it, they'll lose listeners.

Yeah, but we haven't done that with tv. Multi-subs are here to stay it seems. Maybe because we never had that option before.

[Dr. Medulla]

Like, if you're comparing it to how the video streaming networks have all branched out, I'm not sure how that'd work. Up to a couple of years ago, I had all my sporting needs pretty much met by the one subscription channel, 95% covered roughly. Now, some of its gone to BT, some to Amazon and more to some place else. No way in hell, I'm taking out 3 or more subs just to fill the gap that was left, still have the original sub and I'll drop that if it loses any more of what I want to watch. I'll just do without.

I tend to agree with this. If streaming becomes too difficult for users, either through increased paywalls or multiple new streamers split up by label, we're all just going to go back to Soulseek or whatever.

And that's what the industry doesn't get. Streaming's great asset is accessibility and choice. Once they close that down—and they will—people will go back to pirating. Pirating is the base line; if they can't be more attractive than it, they'll lose listeners.

Yeah, but we haven't done that with tv. Multi-subs are here to stay it seems. Maybe because we never had that option before.

Pirating when it comes to tv is a bit more involved compared to music. I mean, I'm still doing it but it is more work and I can see plenty of people saying fuck it and just paying up.

[Kory]

Like, if you're comparing it to how the video streaming networks have all branched out, I'm not sure how that'd work. Up to a couple of years ago, I had all my sporting needs pretty much met by the one subscription channel, 95% covered roughly. Now, some of its gone to BT, some to Amazon and more to some place else. No way in hell, I'm taking out 3 or more subs just to fill the gap that was left, still have the original sub and I'll drop that if it loses any more of what I want to watch. I'll just do without.

I tend to agree with this. If streaming becomes too difficult for users, either through increased paywalls or multiple new streamers split up by label, we're all just going to go back to Soulseek or whatever.

And that's what the industry doesn't get. Streaming's great asset is accessibility and choice. Once they close that down—and they will—people will go back to pirating. Pirating is the base line; if they can't be more attractive than it, they'll lose listeners.

Yeah, but we haven't done that with tv. Multi-subs are here to stay it seems. Maybe because we never had that option before.

Torrenting is still popular, though. Comcast just took away Cartoon Network from my base package and rather than pay a $221 bill every month, I'm instead going to gank Rick and Morty from wherever I can.

[Dr. Medulla]

Torrenting is still popular, though. Comcast just took away Cartoon Network from my base package and rather than pay a $221 bill every month, I'm instead going to gank Rick and Morty from wherever I can.

If you don't know about it, here's an amazing resource for streaming old and new cartoons: https://kimcartoon.li/

[Low Down Low]

I think one difference between music and tv is music is a hell of a lot easier to access free so the threshold for people's patience is quite a bit lower. Or I suspect so anyway. Again, I'll cite a sporting analogy. Round 20 years ago sporting bodies began to sell out to the paywall channels because it was easy revenue and a whole new cashstream. But a reverse trend is becoming noticeable now as they realise they don't get great viewing figures on satellite. Nothing huge yet, but I think we'll see more of it return to free to air as time passes. I think there's a lesson there for the music bosses - less can be more or, at least, there's a median point beyond which they simply shoot themselves in the foot. But likely, greed just gets them and they plough ahead anyway. What usually happens.

[Dr. Medulla]

I think it's out of print, but hunt down Steve Knopper's Appetite for Self-Destruction for a nice narrative history of how the music industry, from 1979 to the early 21st c, consistently resisted new technologies—e.g., compact disc, videos—then went whole hog on them to resist the next wave, at each point succeeding in spite of its actions and learning all the wrong lessons. There is zero reason whatsoever to think those in charge have learned from past mistakes.

[Kory]

Torrenting is still popular, though. Comcast just took away Cartoon Network from my base package and rather than pay a $221 bill every month, I'm instead going to gank Rick and Morty from wherever I can.

If you don't know about it, here's an amazing resource for streaming old and new cartoons: https://kimcartoon.li/

This is supremely helpful, thanks! Looks like a lot of great stuff here (until somebody shuts them down, as per usual).