Except for the wonderful, mad detour through Love You, of course.
The way Beach Boys fans are, I have no idea if you are serious or not.
Well, serious. It's a deranged, cult masterpiece.
Re: Flex's Takes: The Beach Boys
Posted: 26 Jan 2023, 12:01pm
by matedog
Oh and one last thing, I used to think Al was cool - he sang Rhonda, did the Summer in Paradise and Still Cruisin' highlights (Strange Things Happen and Island Girl, respectively), and sided with Brian against Mike in recent years. But this deep dive into their 70s work just kills any love I ever had for Al. He and Mike were super tight, writing the schlockiest shit and not shutting up about transcendental meditation. This is an actual lyric:
Transcendental meditation really works for me good
More much more than I thought it would
Al got a lot cooler in the 21st century. I think he embraced the best parts of his persona and jettisoned the worst.
Can we just say Al sucked in the 70s? Before and after seemed alright.
Re: Flex's Takes: The Beach Boys
Posted: 26 Jan 2023, 12:21pm
by matedog
The details of Dennis' drowning are very interesting/weird:
Morris next saw Wilson around 3 p.m. He had begun diving into the water next to the Emerald's slip, retrieving from the soft bay floor sea-corroded junk that he had thrown off the Harmony when it was anchored there: a rope, some chains, a steel box and, eerily, a silver frame that once held a photo of an ex-wife, model/actress Karen Lamm. "He was in and out of the water, getting a kick out of all the stuff he was finding," recalls Lahti. After diving for about 20 minutes he came out of the water shivering badly, warmed up and ate another sandwich. About 4 p.m. he went back in. "He thought he found a box. He called it a chestful of gold," says Oster. "It was probably a toolbox. He was just being Dennis, entertaining everybody, being his lovable self, goofing around."
About 4:15 p.m. he came up for the last time. "He didn't indicate any problem," says Oster. "I saw him at one end of the slip. He blew a few bubbles and swam to the dinghy very quietly. It was like he was trying to hide. I thought he was clowning. I jumped on the dock to flush him out and then we would all laugh." When Wilson couldn't be found, Oster flagged a passing harbor patrol boat. Meanwhile, Oster, Morris and Lahti frantically searched the deserted docks and nearby bars for Wilson. Lahti, who knew Dennis to be a practical joker, volunteered to dive in, but Oster thought it was a typical "crazy-Dennis" stunt. "I told Bill we'd have surely found him after 20 minutes," Lahti recalls. "Bill said, 'No, he's still joking. He's known to do this sort of thing.' As divers plunged in and probed the bay in the dark, Oster still hoped that Dennis would surface somewhere.
The details of Dennis' drowning are very interesting/weird:
Morris next saw Wilson around 3 p.m. He had begun diving into the water next to the Emerald's slip, retrieving from the soft bay floor sea-corroded junk that he had thrown off the Harmony when it was anchored there: a rope, some chains, a steel box and, eerily, a silver frame that once held a photo of an ex-wife, model/actress Karen Lamm. "He was in and out of the water, getting a kick out of all the stuff he was finding," recalls Lahti. After diving for about 20 minutes he came out of the water shivering badly, warmed up and ate another sandwich. About 4 p.m. he went back in. "He thought he found a box. He called it a chestful of gold," says Oster. "It was probably a toolbox. He was just being Dennis, entertaining everybody, being his lovable self, goofing around."
About 4:15 p.m. he came up for the last time. "He didn't indicate any problem," says Oster. "I saw him at one end of the slip. He blew a few bubbles and swam to the dinghy very quietly. It was like he was trying to hide. I thought he was clowning. I jumped on the dock to flush him out and then we would all laugh." When Wilson couldn't be found, Oster flagged a passing harbor patrol boat. Meanwhile, Oster, Morris and Lahti frantically searched the deserted docks and nearby bars for Wilson. Lahti, who knew Dennis to be a practical joker, volunteered to dive in, but Oster thought it was a typical "crazy-Dennis" stunt. "I told Bill we'd have surely found him after 20 minutes," Lahti recalls. "Bill said, 'No, he's still joking. He's known to do this sort of thing.' As divers plunged in and probed the bay in the dark, Oster still hoped that Dennis would surface somewhere.
His final days are so sad. Booted from the band he loved. Estranged from his wife / child. Broke. Homeless. He claimed he was finally going to enter detox, though some friends have claimed that was purely lip service.
The details of Dennis' drowning are very interesting/weird:
Morris next saw Wilson around 3 p.m. He had begun diving into the water next to the Emerald's slip, retrieving from the soft bay floor sea-corroded junk that he had thrown off the Harmony when it was anchored there: a rope, some chains, a steel box and, eerily, a silver frame that once held a photo of an ex-wife, model/actress Karen Lamm. "He was in and out of the water, getting a kick out of all the stuff he was finding," recalls Lahti. After diving for about 20 minutes he came out of the water shivering badly, warmed up and ate another sandwich. About 4 p.m. he went back in. "He thought he found a box. He called it a chestful of gold," says Oster. "It was probably a toolbox. He was just being Dennis, entertaining everybody, being his lovable self, goofing around."
About 4:15 p.m. he came up for the last time. "He didn't indicate any problem," says Oster. "I saw him at one end of the slip. He blew a few bubbles and swam to the dinghy very quietly. It was like he was trying to hide. I thought he was clowning. I jumped on the dock to flush him out and then we would all laugh." When Wilson couldn't be found, Oster flagged a passing harbor patrol boat. Meanwhile, Oster, Morris and Lahti frantically searched the deserted docks and nearby bars for Wilson. Lahti, who knew Dennis to be a practical joker, volunteered to dive in, but Oster thought it was a typical "crazy-Dennis" stunt. "I told Bill we'd have surely found him after 20 minutes," Lahti recalls. "Bill said, 'No, he's still joking. He's known to do this sort of thing.' As divers plunged in and probed the bay in the dark, Oster still hoped that Dennis would surface somewhere.
His final days are so sad. Booted from the band he loved. Estranged from his wife / child. Broke. Homeless. He claimed he was finally going to enter detox, though some friends have claimed that was purely lip service.
That article mentions a very recent attempt at rehab:
A few days before Christmas he checked into the detox unit at St. John's Hospital and Health Center in Santa Monica. Dr. Joe Takamine, who runs the 21-day detox program, said a blood test taken on admittance showed a.28 alcohol level and traces of cocaine. "He told me he was drinking about a fifth of vodka a day and doing a little coke," Dr. Takamine adds. "I put him on 100 mg. of Librium every two hours so he could come down slowly and maybe start the program in five days." On Christmas, however, he suddenly left. He spent that day drinking with a friend. At 3:30 a.m. Dec. 26, he reportedly checked into the Daniel Freeman Marina Hospital but walked out the next day and later met with Shawn. Then he took off again.
Re: Flex's Takes: The Beach Boys
Posted: 26 Jan 2023, 3:09pm
by Dr. Medulla
Here’s question to all you BB experts: If Murry Wilson isn’t a lunatic in pushing his boys, do they still become successful? The guy is a fucking monster, but is he, in the end, a constructive monster?
Here’s question to all you BB experts: If Murry Wilson isn’t a lunatic in pushing his boys, do they still become successful? The guy is a fucking monster, but is he, in the end, a constructive monster?
Ehhh I think I need WWK to weigh in on the fact-based counterfactual speculation, but I always struggle with these sorts of questions conceptually (same with stuff like did the booze or drugs help fuel an artist). We're all such products of our experiences and environments, take away one hugely important, confounding factor (the driving, abusive father in this case) and do Brian & co. still end up the same way? I mean, I think they'd still be creative in some sense but would they replicate those things that made them a success? My instinct, with most of these kinds of questions, is to say "no." We live the lives we live, and a different life necessarily leads to different results.
That said, Murry tried his hand as a producer for other acts and they went nowhere, so his skill at the job obviously wasn't the deciding factor.
Here’s question to all you BB experts: If Murry Wilson isn’t a lunatic in pushing his boys, do they still become successful? The guy is a fucking monster, but is he, in the end, a constructive monster?
Ehhh I think I need WWK to weigh in on the fact-based counterfactual speculation, but I always struggle with these sorts of questions conceptually (same with stuff like did the booze or drugs help fuel an artist). We're all such products of our experiences and environments, take away one hugely important, confounding factor (the driving, abusive father in this case) and do Brian & co. still end up the same way? I mean, I think they'd still be creative in some sense but would they replicate those things that made them a success? My instinct, with most of these kinds of questions, is to say "no." We live the lives we live, and a different life necessarily leads to different results.
That said, Murry tried his hand as a producer for other acts and they went nowhere, so his skill at the job obviously wasn't the deciding factor.
I agree with this take. I think Murry was a constructive monster (and it's worth nothing that some of the more monstrous stories about Murray may or may not be completely true). He did love his sons and was a dogged supporter of the band early on. He took his job as their manager seriously and I don't believe they would have become successful if not for his relentless cheerleading. That said, like Flex pointed out, we're all a product of our experiences and environments. The Beach Boys benefited from time and place and natural talent. Murry helped shape all of that and I think you could consider him the initial catalyst for what the Beach Boys would become.
