I like it. Found it out of place on the album but I like the idea of it.
“Speak whenever you hear this tone, Scream whenever you hear this tone” definitely a dig at indoctrination regarding the clash of religion in Ireland.
I like it. Found it out of place on the album but I like the idea of it.
Yeah no doubt a message and I listen when Im feeling it depends on my mood when it comes on.Marky Dread wrote: ↑24 May 2021, 4:33pmI like it. Found it out of place on the album but I like the idea of it.
“Speak whenever you hear this tone, Scream whenever you hear this tone” definitely a dig at indoctrination regarding the clash of religion in Ireland.
Sure but novelty and nostalgia don't go hand in hand with something sounding retro. I never accused the album of either of those and they sure pushed up the energy levels but that also comes through the use of a better studio and equipment.Silent Majority wrote: ↑24 May 2021, 4:29pmI'm not downplaying the artistry of the first wave of ska music: as much as I adore the genre as a whole, I think each successive decade has been worse for it since the stuff came out of Jamaica. I just think that, cover versions and all, the Specials' first titled created a cutting edge sound which resounded way beyond novelty and nostalgia.
These are 3 of my favourite albums. I was listening to them upon release in 79 and wasn't aware that they would be considered anyway retro sounding.Marky Dread wrote: ↑24 May 2021, 4:23pmMy point here isn't that the cover versions detract from it being great in any way but that this is all about 1979 and the albums that will most likely be 1-2-3 The Clash/The Specials/The Jam all rely heavily on the past.
I don't like it and never have. I kind of blanked it out. I know where their intentions lay but the use of such hateful language spat out gleefully never sat right with me.Marky Dread wrote: ↑24 May 2021, 4:24pmWhite Noise is shit. Much maligned and misunderstood but none the less crap.
I don't think it's done gleefully. Its perhaps a bit ham fisted though.Heston wrote: ↑24 May 2021, 4:55pmI don't like it and never have. I kind of blanked it out. I know where their intentions lay but the use of such hateful language spat out gleefully never sat right with me.Marky Dread wrote: ↑24 May 2021, 4:24pmWhite Noise is shit. Much maligned and misunderstood but none the less crap.
Well, we understand one another's position.Marky Dread wrote: ↑24 May 2021, 4:46pmSure but novelty and nostalgia don't go hand in hand with something sounding retro. I never accused the album of either of those and they sure pushed up the energy levels but that also comes through the use of a better studio and equipment.Silent Majority wrote: ↑24 May 2021, 4:29pmI'm not downplaying the artistry of the first wave of ska music: as much as I adore the genre as a whole, I think each successive decade has been worse for it since the stuff came out of Jamaica. I just think that, cover versions and all, the Specials' first titled created a cutting edge sound which resounded way beyond novelty and nostalgia.
Take the covers away and there's only half an album. Did they make those songs their own? In a way I suppose so to those that knew nothing of the originals. A lot of rude boys (2nd wave) strived hard to obtain those original records. All the Specials did was speed those songs up a bit. Listen to the Coventry Automatics versions of some of those tracks and they are not so fast.
The Clash had already recorded Pressure Drop long before the Specials album. The Specials supported The Clash and then they knew they had to up the tempo.
The first single "Gangsters" is also basically a cover version. Even sampling the originals opening car sound.
Same here. I once defended it to a black friend of mine. He said it was completely racist. I argued it was anti-racist and that it contained the term "green wogs" which showed that they were using all the derogatory terms aimed at those deemed to be outsiders. He understood the stance but said the song being a rant with hate filled language was helping no one. I had to agree. I think it was their attempt at addressing the mixed message argument that people had with "White Riot" and then deliberately using all the offensive terms they could squeeze into the lyrics. I think it is just a failed song marred to a crap tune.Heston wrote: ↑24 May 2021, 4:55pmI don't like it and never have. I kind of blanked it out. I know where their intentions lay but the use of such hateful language spat out gleefully never sat right with me.Marky Dread wrote: ↑24 May 2021, 4:24pmWhite Noise is shit. Much maligned and misunderstood but none the less crap.
I look at things from over here. You look at things from over there. I love you none the less.Silent Majority wrote: ↑24 May 2021, 5:07pmWell, we understand one another's position.Marky Dread wrote: ↑24 May 2021, 4:46pmSure but novelty and nostalgia don't go hand in hand with something sounding retro. I never accused the album of either of those and they sure pushed up the energy levels but that also comes through the use of a better studio and equipment.Silent Majority wrote: ↑24 May 2021, 4:29pmI'm not downplaying the artistry of the first wave of ska music: as much as I adore the genre as a whole, I think each successive decade has been worse for it since the stuff came out of Jamaica. I just think that, cover versions and all, the Specials' first titled created a cutting edge sound which resounded way beyond novelty and nostalgia.
Take the covers away and there's only half an album. Did they make those songs their own? In a way I suppose so to those that knew nothing of the originals. A lot of rude boys (2nd wave) strived hard to obtain those original records. All the Specials did was speed those songs up a bit. Listen to the Coventry Automatics versions of some of those tracks and they are not so fast.
The Clash had already recorded Pressure Drop long before the Specials album. The Specials supported The Clash and then they knew they had to up the tempo.
The first single "Gangsters" is also basically a cover version. Even sampling the originals opening car sound.
As many others I dare say. But just because you hadn't realised that all three albums contain cover version(s) it doesn't mean the originals never existed.Low Down Low wrote: ↑24 May 2021, 4:50pmThese are 3 of my favourite albums. I was listening to them upon release in 79 and wasn't aware that they would be considered anyway retro sounding.Marky Dread wrote: ↑24 May 2021, 4:23pmMy point here isn't that the cover versions detract from it being great in any way but that this is all about 1979 and the albums that will most likely be 1-2-3 The Clash/The Specials/The Jam all rely heavily on the past.
At the time I didn't realise that a lot of the 2 Tone tracks were covers or based on other songs. I wasn't even aware of Ska prior to 2 Tone. It was all very educational for me and left a life long impression.
These are 3 of my favourite albums. I was listening to them upon release in 79 and wasn't aware that they would be considered anyway retro sounding.Marky Dread wrote: ↑24 May 2021, 4:23pmMy point here isn't that the cover versions detract from it being great in any way but that this is all about 1979 and the albums that will most likely be 1-2-3 The Clash/The Specials/The Jam all rely heavily on the past.
Yeah 2 Tone was a positive in bringing kids of all races together. But here in the UK it was way more complicated. I know of racist skinheads who would play Madness/Specials/The Beat etc. I would have endless arguments/fights with fascist NF supporters who would wear a Madness badge and then scrawl NF on a wall.gkbill wrote: ↑24 May 2021, 5:49pmHello,
I have sat back and appreciated many of the intelligent points made here. Low Down Low's point about not knowing many of these track's were covers is valid and crucial to understanding and appreciating the greatness of the Specials - and Marky's knowledge of these songs and their original artists is equally impressive. We are all looking at the albums much later. If you are considering how these albums have stood up over time, that's a valid perspective to take. I'd like to think how these albums impacted people (myself) in 1979 rather than how they are impacting the world in 2021. London Calling established a punk band as something that wasn't just a one-off; punk bands were worth your time. Many of my friends in 1979 had viewed punk as some goofy, whining, angry bunch of bands that weren't worth spending time - nor money - on via vinyl nor concerts. London Calling changed that. The Specials brought so many people together as it was viewed as disarming - bringing black and white kids together to go crazy dancing to rock (okay, ska) music. In my small limited circle, viewing television, or listening to the radio changed dramatically due to these artists. Elvis opened up that punk (Elvis was considered punk early on) could be great music as well as lyrically potent.
I guess I look at this whole affair as what album made the most impact in 1979 (again, not 2021 - how well has it held up). That's my perspective - valid for me, perhaps not for you. Yours is yours, valid for you - congrats to us both!
Not nice. Got yours yet, btw?Heston wrote: ↑24 May 2021, 8:22amSpectacle wearers.Dr. Medulla wrote: ↑24 May 2021, 8:04amThe idea that IMCT would long tolerate the mixture of hectoring leftist politics and punk-funk was always farcical, and so Gang of Four have predictably been shown the door. What’s next, ya bunch of Tories?