The IMCT observations thread

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Marky Dread
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Re: The IMCT observations thread

Post by Marky Dread »

Mimi wrote:
03 Feb 2023, 11:47am
Marky Dread wrote:
03 Feb 2023, 11:40am
Mimi wrote:
03 Feb 2023, 11:20am
Flex wrote:
03 Feb 2023, 11:02am
Eh, he was a shit on the boards but if that's all it was I think he'd back by now. It's the obsessive, extended threats behind the scenes that turn the tide for me. He's behaved in, like, genuinely unsound manner before and it's not the obligation of the people that was directed to to open themselves back up to abusive behavior on the off chance Steve really means it.

And, frankly, if he has really changed then he'd be able to accept that as an abuser you aren't entitled to forgiveness from the people you abuse. That he is, apparently, fixated on coming back here is a huge red flag to me about how sincere his transformation really is.

I'm sorry Marky, when some of this roiled up a while ago for the first time I was inclined to take your position but I changed my mind after thinking about it. As someone who has had to go through a "I was a huge fuckup and (unintentionally) harmed others, sorry" process myself (although for totally different shit), I don't have a ton of sympathy for the idea that the people you wronged are obligated to do anything to help you feel better. I had to make peace with myself that I was trying to be a better person than I was, and some things just can't be taken back, and Steve's going to have to make that peace too. That's part of the process of being a better person, imho.

I hope this doesn't cause you to leave, Marky. I respect your desire to give Steve another chance, and I sincerely hope Steve has gotten the help he needs and is striving to be a better person. Obviously he needs to make his own decisions, but if he's reading this I'd politely suggest that part of his growth might entail finally putting this place in the rearview mirror.
Exactly. There are a few people who I realize now I had hurt pretty badly in the past. Time, and growing up, I see how I was wrong. As contrite as I am and as much as I've grown as a person, I can't expect to be forgiven by these people. That's entirely up to them. I've learned my lesson, but another part of that lesson, and maybe even a bigger part, is that I have to accept that forgiveness isn't given just because I feel guilty.
I get completely how both Flex and you feel Mimi. But this isn't about any kind of forgiveness.
This is about letting someone having a second chance here and it would be just as simple to ban them again. Maybe that is too much of a risk. But don't hold onto that hurt and allow it to affect your heart.

I'm not a religious guy at all and I accept that trust has to be earned.
This is going to be my last post on this, at least for now because dammit I have work to do, but I just read some of his posts from years back and they're pretty bad. I can see why everyone is apprehensive. Beyond how any of us feel, it's up to Inder. It's his call.

Peace out.
Thanks Mimi appreciated. Don't work too hard. :kiss: 😊
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Kory
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Re: The IMCT observations thread

Post by Kory »

Dr. Medulla wrote:
02 Feb 2023, 7:02pm
Kory wrote:
02 Feb 2023, 6:26pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
02 Feb 2023, 6:07pm
How many people still have Steve on their foe list despite his banishment?
What year was that? I feel like I missed a lot of that kerfuffle for some reason.
Four years ago? It was at Easter, as I recall.
Boy, really? I thought we've been Steveless since before I went back to college...

On the topic of his banishment, I'm not really sure how you even give someone a second chance around here. If they reveal themselves to be a malevolent force, and they get called out by members of the group, I think anything they post after that IS the second chance right? We can't have people who are basically trolls derailing everything in here when we're just trying to discuss things in a civil manner.
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Marky Dread
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Re: The IMCT observations thread

Post by Marky Dread »

Kory wrote:
03 Feb 2023, 1:37pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
02 Feb 2023, 7:02pm
Kory wrote:
02 Feb 2023, 6:26pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
02 Feb 2023, 6:07pm
How many people still have Steve on their foe list despite his banishment?
What year was that? I feel like I missed a lot of that kerfuffle for some reason.
Four years ago? It was at Easter, as I recall.
Boy, really? I thought we've been Steveless since before I went back to college...

On the topic of his banishment, I'm not really sure how you even give someone a second chance around here. If they reveal themselves to be a malevolent force, and they get called out by members of the group, I think anything they post after that IS the second chance right? We can't have people who are basically trolls derailing everything in here when we're just trying to discuss things in a civil manner.
Oh so you're all for civility now. 🤣
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Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty


We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.

"Without the common people you're nothing"

Nos Sumus Una Familia

Kory
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Re: The IMCT observations thread

Post by Kory »

Marky Dread wrote:
03 Feb 2023, 1:48pm
Kory wrote:
03 Feb 2023, 1:37pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
02 Feb 2023, 7:02pm
Kory wrote:
02 Feb 2023, 6:26pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
02 Feb 2023, 6:07pm
How many people still have Steve on their foe list despite his banishment?
What year was that? I feel like I missed a lot of that kerfuffle for some reason.
Four years ago? It was at Easter, as I recall.
Boy, really? I thought we've been Steveless since before I went back to college...

On the topic of his banishment, I'm not really sure how you even give someone a second chance around here. If they reveal themselves to be a malevolent force, and they get called out by members of the group, I think anything they post after that IS the second chance right? We can't have people who are basically trolls derailing everything in here when we're just trying to discuss things in a civil manner.
Oh so you're all for civility now. 🤣
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"Suck our Earth dick, Martians!" —Doc

Low Down Low
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Re: The IMCT observations thread

Post by Low Down Low »

Just out of idle curiosity, i did a search of Steve posts, saw the majority of the most recent ones were in the "Gun politics" thread and thought, nah, i'll leave it.

Marky Dread
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Re: The IMCT observations thread

Post by Marky Dread »

Low Down Low wrote:
03 Feb 2023, 2:18pm
Just out of idle curiosity, i did a search of Steve posts, saw the majority of the most recent ones were in the "Gun politics" thread and thought, nah, i'll leave it.
It certainly brought out the worst in people. I read through some of it before my head exploded. Debating takes two and there's a bunch of stuff there I would not want to be associated with. Steve has told me he knows he acted like a jerk and is ashamed of himself. His words not mine. That's a positive thing in my eyes to admit you're wrong and made mistakes.
Image

Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty


We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.

"Without the common people you're nothing"

Nos Sumus Una Familia

matedog
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Re: The IMCT observations thread

Post by matedog »

Giving my $0.02, I went through a similar situation. I had been meaning to email someone that I had wronged. And it took my years to get around to it, which is shitty. But when I finally starting doing it, I tried to think of where they were coming from and what I was really trying to accomplish with my apology. In the process, I realized I shouldn't expect and didn't deserve forgiveness. In the end, I acknowledged that and basically told the person that I realized how shitty it was, didn't expect any kind of forgiveness, but wanted to make sure they knew that I knew that I was shitty.

The person never responded. Not sure if they got the email or not, but again, they don't owe me anything.
Look, you have to establish context for these things. And I maintain that unless you appreciate the Fall of Constantinople, the Great Fire of London, and Mickey Mantle's fatalist alcoholism, live Freddy makes no sense. If you want to half-ass it, fine, go call Simon Schama to do the appendix.

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Re: The IMCT observations thread

Post by Flex »

matedog wrote:
06 Feb 2023, 5:16pm
Giving my $0.02, I went through a similar situation. I had been meaning to email someone that I had wronged. And it took my years to get around to it, which is shitty. But when I finally starting doing it, I tried to think of where they were coming from and what I was really trying to accomplish with my apology. In the process, I realized I shouldn't expect and didn't deserve forgiveness. In the end, I acknowledged that and basically told the person that I realized how shitty it was, didn't expect any kind of forgiveness, but wanted to make sure they knew that I knew that I was shitty.

The person never responded. Not sure if they got the email or not, but again, they don't owe me anything.
Sorry, I meant to respond to you. I finally feel like I'm in a place to forgive you for scratching my Marcy Playground CD.
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Re: The IMCT observations thread

Post by matedog »

Additionally, I never had any specifically negative or inappropriate interactions with Steve. When he sent out the Walker demos, he messaged me on fb saying something like "I know I was an ass and burned bridges, but I wanted to get this out." I told him that in spite of our differences, we do share a love of Joe/The Clash and I appreciated him getting it out there.

Again, I had no specific issues with him, but I understand others do, so I'll defer to others.
Look, you have to establish context for these things. And I maintain that unless you appreciate the Fall of Constantinople, the Great Fire of London, and Mickey Mantle's fatalist alcoholism, live Freddy makes no sense. If you want to half-ass it, fine, go call Simon Schama to do the appendix.

matedog
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Re: The IMCT observations thread

Post by matedog »

Flex wrote:
06 Feb 2023, 5:18pm
matedog wrote:
06 Feb 2023, 5:16pm
Giving my $0.02, I went through a similar situation. I had been meaning to email someone that I had wronged. And it took my years to get around to it, which is shitty. But when I finally starting doing it, I tried to think of where they were coming from and what I was really trying to accomplish with my apology. In the process, I realized I shouldn't expect and didn't deserve forgiveness. In the end, I acknowledged that and basically told the person that I realized how shitty it was, didn't expect any kind of forgiveness, but wanted to make sure they knew that I knew that I was shitty.

The person never responded. Not sure if they got the email or not, but again, they don't owe me anything.
Sorry, I meant to respond to you. I finally feel like I'm in a place to forgive you for scratching my Marcy Playground CD.
Well I will never forgive you for not returning my copy of Shapeshifter.
Look, you have to establish context for these things. And I maintain that unless you appreciate the Fall of Constantinople, the Great Fire of London, and Mickey Mantle's fatalist alcoholism, live Freddy makes no sense. If you want to half-ass it, fine, go call Simon Schama to do the appendix.

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Re: The IMCT observations thread

Post by revbob »

matedog wrote:
06 Feb 2023, 5:19pm
Additionally, I never had any specifically negative or inappropriate interactions with Steve. When he sent out the Walker demos, he messaged me on fb saying something like "I know I was an ass and burned bridges, but I wanted to get this out." I told him that in spite of our differences, we do share a love of Joe/The Clash and I appreciated him getting it out there.

Again, I had no specific issues with him, but I understand others do, so I'll defer to others.
You must have given him those Sigue Sigue Sputnik recordings he was searching for.

Flex
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Re: The IMCT observations thread

Post by Flex »

matedog wrote:
06 Feb 2023, 5:20pm
Well I will never forgive you for not returning my copy of Shapeshifter.
It's an underated gem and I won't ever apologize for stealing as many copies of it as I could from as many people as I could! If I had to do it over, I'd steal it even faster and with even less remorse!
Wiggle, wiggle, wiggle like a bowl of soup
Wiggle, wiggle, wiggle like a rolling hoop
Wiggle, wiggle, wiggle like a ton of lead
Wiggle - you can raise the dead

Pex Lives!

matedog
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Re: The IMCT observations thread

Post by matedog »

Flex wrote:
06 Feb 2023, 5:23pm
matedog wrote:
06 Feb 2023, 5:20pm
Well I will never forgive you for not returning my copy of Shapeshifter.
It's an underated gem and I won't ever apologize for stealing as many copies of it as I could from as many people as I could! If I had to do it over, I'd steal it even faster and with even less remorse!
I actually had to google what the follow up album was. Maybe I'll give a spin now...
Look, you have to establish context for these things. And I maintain that unless you appreciate the Fall of Constantinople, the Great Fire of London, and Mickey Mantle's fatalist alcoholism, live Freddy makes no sense. If you want to half-ass it, fine, go call Simon Schama to do the appendix.

matedog
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Re: The IMCT observations thread

Post by matedog »

matedog wrote:
06 Feb 2023, 5:24pm
Flex wrote:
06 Feb 2023, 5:23pm
matedog wrote:
06 Feb 2023, 5:20pm
Well I will never forgive you for not returning my copy of Shapeshifter.
It's an underated gem and I won't ever apologize for stealing as many copies of it as I could from as many people as I could! If I had to do it over, I'd steal it even faster and with even less remorse!
I actually had to google what the follow up album was. Maybe I'll give a spin now...
"Wave Motion Gun" isn't bad.
Look, you have to establish context for these things. And I maintain that unless you appreciate the Fall of Constantinople, the Great Fire of London, and Mickey Mantle's fatalist alcoholism, live Freddy makes no sense. If you want to half-ass it, fine, go call Simon Schama to do the appendix.

Flex
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Re: The IMCT observations thread

Post by Flex »

matedog wrote:
06 Feb 2023, 5:24pm
I actually had to google what the follow up album was. Maybe I'll give a spin now...
I distinctly remember getting it for Christmas (along with the first Dave Matthews / Tim Reynolds live album :cool: ) and being like "finally, I'm on the bleeding edge of popular music. Surely I'll be one of the cool kids now." Ah, well, about that...

(I do like the album tho)
Wiggle, wiggle, wiggle like a bowl of soup
Wiggle, wiggle, wiggle like a rolling hoop
Wiggle, wiggle, wiggle like a ton of lead
Wiggle - you can raise the dead

Pex Lives!

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