The IMCT observations thread

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Dr. Medulla
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Re: The IMCT observations thread

Post by Dr. Medulla »

matedog wrote:
15 May 2023, 1:51pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
15 May 2023, 12:51pm
matedog wrote:
15 May 2023, 11:40am
June got this Polaroid of Flex for proof of life.
Polaroid? What kind of retro-cool hipster are you?
Is pre-irony a thing?
I recall reading once that the difference between kitsch and camp is that kitsch is celebrated for being awful, it's always been awful. Black velvet Elvis paintings are kitsch. But camp is that which was once seriously valued, then became scorned, and then became valued because it was both once valued then scorned. So 1970s polyester leisure suits are camp because they were hip, then they became mocked, and now anyone who wears them because of that weird history does so for camp value. So pre-irony might be the original stage for something that becomes camp?
"I never doubted myself for a minute for I knew that my monkey-strong bowels were girded with strength, like the loins of a dragon ribboned with fat and the opulence of buffalo dung." - Richard Nixon, Checkers Speech, abandoned early draft

matedog
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Re: The IMCT observations thread

Post by matedog »

Dr. Medulla wrote:
15 May 2023, 2:01pm
matedog wrote:
15 May 2023, 1:51pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
15 May 2023, 12:51pm
matedog wrote:
15 May 2023, 11:40am
June got this Polaroid of Flex for proof of life.
Polaroid? What kind of retro-cool hipster are you?
Is pre-irony a thing?
I recall reading once that the difference between kitsch and camp is that kitsch is celebrated for being awful, it's always been awful. Black velvet Elvis paintings are kitsch. But camp is that which was once seriously valued, then became scorned, and then became valued because it was both once valued then scorned. So 1970s polyester leisure suits are camp because they were hip, then they became mocked, and now anyone who wears them because of that weird history does so for camp value. So pre-irony might be the original stage for something that becomes camp?
That makes sense. I wonder how that relates to post irony.
Look, you have to establish context for these things. And I maintain that unless you appreciate the Fall of Constantinople, the Great Fire of London, and Mickey Mantle's fatalist alcoholism, live Freddy makes no sense. If you want to half-ass it, fine, go call Simon Schama to do the appendix.

Dr. Medulla
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Re: The IMCT observations thread

Post by Dr. Medulla »

matedog wrote:
15 May 2023, 2:15pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
15 May 2023, 2:01pm
matedog wrote:
15 May 2023, 1:51pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
15 May 2023, 12:51pm
matedog wrote:
15 May 2023, 11:40am
June got this Polaroid of Flex for proof of life.
Polaroid? What kind of retro-cool hipster are you?
Is pre-irony a thing?
I recall reading once that the difference between kitsch and camp is that kitsch is celebrated for being awful, it's always been awful. Black velvet Elvis paintings are kitsch. But camp is that which was once seriously valued, then became scorned, and then became valued because it was both once valued then scorned. So 1970s polyester leisure suits are camp because they were hip, then they became mocked, and now anyone who wears them because of that weird history does so for camp value. So pre-irony might be the original stage for something that becomes camp?
That makes sense. I wonder how that relates to post irony.
Not a clue. Something that doesn't consider an item's history and is valued only in the here and now?
"I never doubted myself for a minute for I knew that my monkey-strong bowels were girded with strength, like the loins of a dragon ribboned with fat and the opulence of buffalo dung." - Richard Nixon, Checkers Speech, abandoned early draft

matedog
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Re: The IMCT observations thread

Post by matedog »

Dr. Medulla wrote:
15 May 2023, 2:34pm
matedog wrote:
15 May 2023, 2:15pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
15 May 2023, 2:01pm
matedog wrote:
15 May 2023, 1:51pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
15 May 2023, 12:51pm


Polaroid? What kind of retro-cool hipster are you?
Is pre-irony a thing?
I recall reading once that the difference between kitsch and camp is that kitsch is celebrated for being awful, it's always been awful. Black velvet Elvis paintings are kitsch. But camp is that which was once seriously valued, then became scorned, and then became valued because it was both once valued then scorned. So 1970s polyester leisure suits are camp because they were hip, then they became mocked, and now anyone who wears them because of that weird history does so for camp value. So pre-irony might be the original stage for something that becomes camp?
That makes sense. I wonder how that relates to post irony.
Not a clue. Something that doesn't consider an item's history and is valued only in the here and now?
So post-irony is genuinely enjoying something after a period where it was ironically enjoyed. I think Kelly Clarkson is an oft cited example. So it's kinda post-camp too by that point, I think. Perhaps potentially post-kitsch too? My head is starting to spin.
Look, you have to establish context for these things. And I maintain that unless you appreciate the Fall of Constantinople, the Great Fire of London, and Mickey Mantle's fatalist alcoholism, live Freddy makes no sense. If you want to half-ass it, fine, go call Simon Schama to do the appendix.

Dr. Medulla
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Re: The IMCT observations thread

Post by Dr. Medulla »

matedog wrote:
15 May 2023, 4:07pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
15 May 2023, 2:34pm
matedog wrote:
15 May 2023, 2:15pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
15 May 2023, 2:01pm
matedog wrote:
15 May 2023, 1:51pm


Is pre-irony a thing?
I recall reading once that the difference between kitsch and camp is that kitsch is celebrated for being awful, it's always been awful. Black velvet Elvis paintings are kitsch. But camp is that which was once seriously valued, then became scorned, and then became valued because it was both once valued then scorned. So 1970s polyester leisure suits are camp because they were hip, then they became mocked, and now anyone who wears them because of that weird history does so for camp value. So pre-irony might be the original stage for something that becomes camp?
That makes sense. I wonder how that relates to post irony.
Not a clue. Something that doesn't consider an item's history and is valued only in the here and now?
So post-irony is genuinely enjoying something after a period where it was ironically enjoyed. I think Kelly Clarkson is an oft cited example. So it's kinda post-camp too by that point, I think. Perhaps potentially post-kitsch too? My head is starting to spin.
Based on your definition, I guess it would be post-kitsch or unkitsch or something like that. It'd be akin, I suppose, to how writers like Jim Thompson were dismissed as cheap and lazy writers in their time and then rediscovered and declared geniuses.
"I never doubted myself for a minute for I knew that my monkey-strong bowels were girded with strength, like the loins of a dragon ribboned with fat and the opulence of buffalo dung." - Richard Nixon, Checkers Speech, abandoned early draft

Silent Majority
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Re: The IMCT observations thread

Post by Silent Majority »

Unkitsch. I like it.
a lifetime serving one machine
Is ten times worse than prison


www.pexlives.libsyn.com/

revbob
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Re: The IMCT observations thread

Post by revbob »

matedog wrote:
15 May 2023, 4:07pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
15 May 2023, 2:34pm
matedog wrote:
15 May 2023, 2:15pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
15 May 2023, 2:01pm
matedog wrote:
15 May 2023, 1:51pm


Is pre-irony a thing?
I recall reading once that the difference between kitsch and camp is that kitsch is celebrated for being awful, it's always been awful. Black velvet Elvis paintings are kitsch. But camp is that which was once seriously valued, then became scorned, and then became valued because it was both once valued then scorned. So 1970s polyester leisure suits are camp because they were hip, then they became mocked, and now anyone who wears them because of that weird history does so for camp value. So pre-irony might be the original stage for something that becomes camp?
That makes sense. I wonder how that relates to post irony.
Not a clue. Something that doesn't consider an item's history and is valued only in the here and now?
So post-irony is genuinely enjoying something after a period where it was ironically enjoyed. I think Kelly Clarkson is an oft cited example. So it's kinda post-camp too by that point, I think. Perhaps potentially post-kitsch too? My head is starting to spin.
Awful

matedog
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Re: The IMCT observations thread

Post by matedog »

revbob wrote:
15 May 2023, 6:30pm
matedog wrote:
15 May 2023, 4:07pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
15 May 2023, 2:34pm
matedog wrote:
15 May 2023, 2:15pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
15 May 2023, 2:01pm


I recall reading once that the difference between kitsch and camp is that kitsch is celebrated for being awful, it's always been awful. Black velvet Elvis paintings are kitsch. But camp is that which was once seriously valued, then became scorned, and then became valued because it was both once valued then scorned. So 1970s polyester leisure suits are camp because they were hip, then they became mocked, and now anyone who wears them because of that weird history does so for camp value. So pre-irony might be the original stage for something that becomes camp?
That makes sense. I wonder how that relates to post irony.
Not a clue. Something that doesn't consider an item's history and is valued only in the here and now?
So post-irony is genuinely enjoying something after a period where it was ironically enjoyed. I think Kelly Clarkson is an oft cited example. So it's kinda post-camp too by that point, I think. Perhaps potentially post-kitsch too? My head is starting to spin.
Awful
Exactly. It's this out of touch elder mindset that allows for the formulation of post-irony. Without Rev, there's nothing to push back against.
Look, you have to establish context for these things. And I maintain that unless you appreciate the Fall of Constantinople, the Great Fire of London, and Mickey Mantle's fatalist alcoholism, live Freddy makes no sense. If you want to half-ass it, fine, go call Simon Schama to do the appendix.

revbob
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Re: The IMCT observations thread

Post by revbob »

matedog wrote:
15 May 2023, 6:34pm
revbob wrote:
15 May 2023, 6:30pm
matedog wrote:
15 May 2023, 4:07pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
15 May 2023, 2:34pm
matedog wrote:
15 May 2023, 2:15pm

That makes sense. I wonder how that relates to post irony.
Not a clue. Something that doesn't consider an item's history and is valued only in the here and now?
So post-irony is genuinely enjoying something after a period where it was ironically enjoyed. I think Kelly Clarkson is an oft cited example. So it's kinda post-camp too by that point, I think. Perhaps potentially post-kitsch too? My head is starting to spin.
Awful
Exactly. It's this out of touch elder mindset that allows for the formulation of post-irony. Without Rev, there's nothing to push back against.
You're 40 and Im not nearly as old as you think. That said yeah her music sucks, she might be a decent person but anyone crowned by Simon Douchbag isnt worth of my time.

matedog
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Re: The IMCT observations thread

Post by matedog »

revbob wrote:
15 May 2023, 6:46pm
matedog wrote:
15 May 2023, 6:34pm
revbob wrote:
15 May 2023, 6:30pm
matedog wrote:
15 May 2023, 4:07pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
15 May 2023, 2:34pm


Not a clue. Something that doesn't consider an item's history and is valued only in the here and now?
So post-irony is genuinely enjoying something after a period where it was ironically enjoyed. I think Kelly Clarkson is an oft cited example. So it's kinda post-camp too by that point, I think. Perhaps potentially post-kitsch too? My head is starting to spin.
Awful
Exactly. It's this out of touch elder mindset that allows for the formulation of post-irony. Without Rev, there's nothing to push back against.
You're 40 and Im not nearly as old as you think. That said yeah her music sucks, she might be a decent person but anyone crowned by Simon Douchbag isnt worth of my time.
I'm barely 40! :angry:
Look, you have to establish context for these things. And I maintain that unless you appreciate the Fall of Constantinople, the Great Fire of London, and Mickey Mantle's fatalist alcoholism, live Freddy makes no sense. If you want to half-ass it, fine, go call Simon Schama to do the appendix.

Flex
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Re: The IMCT observations thread

Post by Flex »

Is bathroom jail post-ironic or post-kitsch?
Wiggle, wiggle, wiggle like a bowl of soup
Wiggle, wiggle, wiggle like a rolling hoop
Wiggle, wiggle, wiggle like a ton of lead
Wiggle - you can raise the dead

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revbob
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Re: The IMCT observations thread

Post by revbob »

matedog wrote:
15 May 2023, 6:50pm
revbob wrote:
15 May 2023, 6:46pm
matedog wrote:
15 May 2023, 6:34pm
revbob wrote:
15 May 2023, 6:30pm
matedog wrote:
15 May 2023, 4:07pm

So post-irony is genuinely enjoying something after a period where it was ironically enjoyed. I think Kelly Clarkson is an oft cited example. So it's kinda post-camp too by that point, I think. Perhaps potentially post-kitsch too? My head is starting to spin.
Awful
Exactly. It's this out of touch elder mindset that allows for the formulation of post-irony. Without Rev, there's nothing to push back against.
You're 40 and Im not nearly as old as you think. That said yeah her music sucks, she might be a decent person but anyone crowned by Simon Douchbag isnt worth of my time.
I'm barely 40! :angry:
And Im barely 50 so suck it old man

Dr. Medulla
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Re: The IMCT observations thread

Post by Dr. Medulla »

Flex wrote:
15 May 2023, 7:07pm
Is bathroom jail post-ironic or post-kitsch?
Post-legal?
"I never doubted myself for a minute for I knew that my monkey-strong bowels were girded with strength, like the loins of a dragon ribboned with fat and the opulence of buffalo dung." - Richard Nixon, Checkers Speech, abandoned early draft

Heston
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Re: The IMCT observations thread

Post by Heston »

I joined this board 20 years ago today. Wow, those years flew over.
There's a tiny, tiny hopeful part of me that says you guys are running a Kaufmanesque long con on the board

Dr. Medulla
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Re: The IMCT observations thread

Post by Dr. Medulla »

Heston wrote:
23 Dec 2023, 1:03pm
I joined this board 20 years ago today. Wow, those years flew over.
It's roughly the same time span covering John Lennon forming the Beatles and being murdered. Which seemingly doesn't quite add up, and yet it's true.
"I never doubted myself for a minute for I knew that my monkey-strong bowels were girded with strength, like the loins of a dragon ribboned with fat and the opulence of buffalo dung." - Richard Nixon, Checkers Speech, abandoned early draft

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