Flex and Wolter's Den of Nerdly Awesomeness
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Re: Flex and Wolter's Den of Nerdly Awesomeness
I do think if Secret War was actually discussed and planned with all editorial and writers in the loop, that whole lost time issue could be been written better and be a cool sort of mystery for the readers, but it was just a shit story with little point that did more harm than good to the books when it ran.
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Re: Flex and Wolter's Den of Nerdly Awesomeness
Ah, right! He cheated on Kitty Pryde.Wolter wrote: ↑15 Nov 2021, 10:17amThe worst thing in my book was that it gave Colossus a weird love interest that died, thus making him suddenly a mope who acted like a dick. Honestly, the naked contempt Shooter had was evident, because he wrote all the mutant characters like it was still 1975.Dr. Medulla wrote: ↑15 Nov 2021, 9:40amThat rings a bell, so I must have had that issue.
The other thing about SW was that it took an entire year to fully play out, but in all the other books, it happened between issues. So for the next year (until SW concluded) the characters had all gone thru this remarkable event yet didn't speak much of what happened, talking around it, so as to not reveal things that wouldn't be published for several months. What a wretched editorial edict for the writers to labour under.
This morning I read the issue where a mountain range is dropped on the heroes. There's suspension of disbelief and then there's … yeah, if I were 13 I'd come up with that idea.
"Grab some wood, bub.'" - Richard Nixon, Checkers Speech, abandoned early draft
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Re: Flex and Wolter's Den of Nerdly Awesomeness
Jim Shooter: pro comics writer at age 16. Zero growth since.Dr. Medulla wrote: ↑15 Nov 2021, 10:33amAh, right! He cheated on Kitty Pryde.Wolter wrote: ↑15 Nov 2021, 10:17amThe worst thing in my book was that it gave Colossus a weird love interest that died, thus making him suddenly a mope who acted like a dick. Honestly, the naked contempt Shooter had was evident, because he wrote all the mutant characters like it was still 1975.Dr. Medulla wrote: ↑15 Nov 2021, 9:40amThat rings a bell, so I must have had that issue.
The other thing about SW was that it took an entire year to fully play out, but in all the other books, it happened between issues. So for the next year (until SW concluded) the characters had all gone thru this remarkable event yet didn't speak much of what happened, talking around it, so as to not reveal things that wouldn't be published for several months. What a wretched editorial edict for the writers to labour under.
This morning I read the issue where a mountain range is dropped on the heroes. There's suspension of disbelief and then there's … yeah, if I were 13 I'd come up with that idea.
”INDER LOCK THE THE KISS THREAD IVE REALISED IM A PRZE IDOOT” - Thomas Jefferson
"But the gorilla thinks otherwise!"
"But the gorilla thinks otherwise!"
- Dr. Medulla
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Re: Flex and Wolter's Den of Nerdly Awesomeness
Ha! Very mixed evaluations as EIC of Marvel, too.Wolter wrote: ↑15 Nov 2021, 10:40amJim Shooter: pro comics writer at age 16. Zero growth since.Dr. Medulla wrote: ↑15 Nov 2021, 10:33amAh, right! He cheated on Kitty Pryde.Wolter wrote: ↑15 Nov 2021, 10:17amThe worst thing in my book was that it gave Colossus a weird love interest that died, thus making him suddenly a mope who acted like a dick. Honestly, the naked contempt Shooter had was evident, because he wrote all the mutant characters like it was still 1975.Dr. Medulla wrote: ↑15 Nov 2021, 9:40amThat rings a bell, so I must have had that issue.
The other thing about SW was that it took an entire year to fully play out, but in all the other books, it happened between issues. So for the next year (until SW concluded) the characters had all gone thru this remarkable event yet didn't speak much of what happened, talking around it, so as to not reveal things that wouldn't be published for several months. What a wretched editorial edict for the writers to labour under.
This morning I read the issue where a mountain range is dropped on the heroes. There's suspension of disbelief and then there's … yeah, if I were 13 I'd come up with that idea.
"Grab some wood, bub.'" - Richard Nixon, Checkers Speech, abandoned early draft
- Wolter
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Re: Flex and Wolter's Den of Nerdly Awesomeness
I think he was a blessing and a curse in the job. Marvel before him was a bunch of drugged out wackos making whatever crazy shot they could, with a lot of inmates running the asylum. He brought stability and a lot of financial success to them, but at the cost of losing a lot of that weird magic. You’ll note his run largely coincides with no weird ass Jim Starlin cosmic craziness.Dr. Medulla wrote: ↑15 Nov 2021, 11:11amHa! Very mixed evaluations as EIC of Marvel, too.Wolter wrote: ↑15 Nov 2021, 10:40amJim Shooter: pro comics writer at age 16. Zero growth since.Dr. Medulla wrote: ↑15 Nov 2021, 10:33amAh, right! He cheated on Kitty Pryde.Wolter wrote: ↑15 Nov 2021, 10:17amThe worst thing in my book was that it gave Colossus a weird love interest that died, thus making him suddenly a mope who acted like a dick. Honestly, the naked contempt Shooter had was evident, because he wrote all the mutant characters like it was still 1975.Dr. Medulla wrote: ↑15 Nov 2021, 9:40am
That rings a bell, so I must have had that issue.
The other thing about SW was that it took an entire year to fully play out, but in all the other books, it happened between issues. So for the next year (until SW concluded) the characters had all gone thru this remarkable event yet didn't speak much of what happened, talking around it, so as to not reveal things that wouldn't be published for several months. What a wretched editorial edict for the writers to labour under.
This morning I read the issue where a mountain range is dropped on the heroes. There's suspension of disbelief and then there's … yeah, if I were 13 I'd come up with that idea.
”INDER LOCK THE THE KISS THREAD IVE REALISED IM A PRZE IDOOT” - Thomas Jefferson
"But the gorilla thinks otherwise!"
"But the gorilla thinks otherwise!"
- Dr. Medulla
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Re: Flex and Wolter's Den of Nerdly Awesomeness
That's my understanding of the consensus take. He brought order to a company that risked going under because the creatives were unaccountable, but after a time he couldn't stop looking for/creating problems to fix.Wolter wrote: ↑15 Nov 2021, 11:56amI think he was a blessing and a curse in the job. Marvel before him was a bunch of drugged out wackos making whatever crazy shot they could, with a lot of inmates running the asylum. He brought stability and a lot of financial success to them, but at the cost of losing a lot of that weird magic. You’ll note his run largely coincides with no weird ass Jim Starlin cosmic craziness.Dr. Medulla wrote: ↑15 Nov 2021, 11:11amHa! Very mixed evaluations as EIC of Marvel, too.Wolter wrote: ↑15 Nov 2021, 10:40amJim Shooter: pro comics writer at age 16. Zero growth since.Dr. Medulla wrote: ↑15 Nov 2021, 10:33amAh, right! He cheated on Kitty Pryde.
This morning I read the issue where a mountain range is dropped on the heroes. There's suspension of disbelief and then there's … yeah, if I were 13 I'd come up with that idea.
"Grab some wood, bub.'" - Richard Nixon, Checkers Speech, abandoned early draft
Re: Flex and Wolter's Den of Nerdly Awesomeness
The more recent Secret War storyline was actually pretty good for a number of reasons, chief among them being that it's written by Hickman and it ended the Ultimate Universe.Dr. Medulla wrote: ↑15 Nov 2021, 10:33amAh, right! He cheated on Kitty Pryde.Wolter wrote: ↑15 Nov 2021, 10:17amThe worst thing in my book was that it gave Colossus a weird love interest that died, thus making him suddenly a mope who acted like a dick. Honestly, the naked contempt Shooter had was evident, because he wrote all the mutant characters like it was still 1975.Dr. Medulla wrote: ↑15 Nov 2021, 9:40amThat rings a bell, so I must have had that issue.
The other thing about SW was that it took an entire year to fully play out, but in all the other books, it happened between issues. So for the next year (until SW concluded) the characters had all gone thru this remarkable event yet didn't speak much of what happened, talking around it, so as to not reveal things that wouldn't be published for several months. What a wretched editorial edict for the writers to labour under.
This morning I read the issue where a mountain range is dropped on the heroes. There's suspension of disbelief and then there's … yeah, if I were 13 I'd come up with that idea.
"Suck our Earth dick, Martians!" —Doc
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Re: Flex and Wolter's Den of Nerdly Awesomeness
I only know Hickman from his FF. Wasn't thrilled (not a fan of the FF as cosmic, multi-dimensional wanderers).Kory wrote: ↑15 Nov 2021, 5:57pmThe more recent Secret War storyline was actually pretty good for a number of reasons, chief among them being that it's written by Hickman and it ended the Ultimate Universe.Dr. Medulla wrote: ↑15 Nov 2021, 10:33amAh, right! He cheated on Kitty Pryde.Wolter wrote: ↑15 Nov 2021, 10:17amThe worst thing in my book was that it gave Colossus a weird love interest that died, thus making him suddenly a mope who acted like a dick. Honestly, the naked contempt Shooter had was evident, because he wrote all the mutant characters like it was still 1975.Dr. Medulla wrote: ↑15 Nov 2021, 9:40amThat rings a bell, so I must have had that issue.
The other thing about SW was that it took an entire year to fully play out, but in all the other books, it happened between issues. So for the next year (until SW concluded) the characters had all gone thru this remarkable event yet didn't speak much of what happened, talking around it, so as to not reveal things that wouldn't be published for several months. What a wretched editorial edict for the writers to labour under.
This morning I read the issue where a mountain range is dropped on the heroes. There's suspension of disbelief and then there's … yeah, if I were 13 I'd come up with that idea.
"Grab some wood, bub.'" - Richard Nixon, Checkers Speech, abandoned early draft
- Dr. Medulla
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Re: Flex and Wolter's Den of Nerdly Awesomeness
Finished reading Secret Wars. God, what a dog. Dumb idea executed ever more inanely. It really does read like fanfic. Given that Marvel had a ton of talent at the time, I can't help but wonder how a competent writer would have tackled it.
"Grab some wood, bub.'" - Richard Nixon, Checkers Speech, abandoned early draft
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Re: Flex and Wolter's Den of Nerdly Awesomeness
We reach the parts other combos cannot reach
We beach the beachheads other armies cannot beach
We speak the tongues other mouths cannot speak
We beach the beachheads other armies cannot beach
We speak the tongues other mouths cannot speak
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Re: Flex and Wolter's Den of Nerdly Awesomeness
This one's for Tep …
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Re: Flex and Wolter's Den of Nerdly Awesomeness
I feel like a competent writer would’ve just said no.Dr. Medulla wrote: ↑16 Nov 2021, 6:46pmFinished reading Secret Wars. God, what a dog. Dumb idea executed ever more inanely. It really does read like fanfic. Given that Marvel had a ton of talent at the time, I can't help but wonder how a competent writer would have tackled it.
I’m kidding. The idea of a bunch of heroes disappearing and coming back changed in ways explained by a miniseries could’ve been a great story, if and only if it were carefully planned and agreed upon by all the major writers/editors involved. And if a writer much better than Shooter was in charge of it.
”INDER LOCK THE THE KISS THREAD IVE REALISED IM A PRZE IDOOT” - Thomas Jefferson
"But the gorilla thinks otherwise!"
"But the gorilla thinks otherwise!"
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Re: Flex and Wolter's Den of Nerdly Awesomeness
I also just finished reading Secret Society of Supervillains, a brief DC series in the late 70s, focusing on, duh, a kind of anti-Justice League. Not a bad concept to try out, but you can tell that the company had no idea what it wanted to do because pretty much every issue has a different writer and artist on it. Launch a new series and treat it as filler? Not good. But structurally, the concept doesn't have legs. The villains can't actually succeed in their scheme du jour, but they can't fully fail either, so it's pretty much a Gilligan's Island situation. Unless the focus is on how villains fail, the appeal is vague.
Reading early Avengers now, which, apart from scattered issues, I've never done. (The reason for more older comics reading is the new iPad, which has so much storage that I can afford to load up comics onto it.)
Reading early Avengers now, which, apart from scattered issues, I've never done. (The reason for more older comics reading is the new iPad, which has so much storage that I can afford to load up comics onto it.)
"Grab some wood, bub.'" - Richard Nixon, Checkers Speech, abandoned early draft
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Re: Flex and Wolter's Den of Nerdly Awesomeness
The Avengers are a surprising personal blind spot for me overall. It was never a book I read as a kid, so it never was one I’ve gone back to.Dr. Medulla wrote: ↑19 Nov 2021, 3:32pmI also just finished reading Secret Society of Supervillains, a brief DC series in the late 70s, focusing on, duh, a kind of anti-Justice League. Not a bad concept to try out, but you can tell that the company had no idea what it wanted to do because pretty much every issue has a different writer and artist on it. Launch a new series and treat it as filler? Not good. But structurally, the concept doesn't have legs. The villains can't actually succeed in their scheme du jour, but they can't fully fail either, so it's pretty much a Gilligan's Island situation. Unless the focus is on how villains fail, the appeal is vague.
Reading early Avengers now, which, apart from scattered issues, I've never done. (The reason for more older comics reading is the new iPad, which has so much storage that I can afford to load up comics onto it.)
”INDER LOCK THE THE KISS THREAD IVE REALISED IM A PRZE IDOOT” - Thomas Jefferson
"But the gorilla thinks otherwise!"
"But the gorilla thinks otherwise!"
- Dr. Medulla
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Re: Flex and Wolter's Den of Nerdly Awesomeness
The first three issues are … jarring … for how Stan writes the Hulk. He seems more like a green Thing than the kind of brute caveman he was later characterized. And the Wasp is pretty horny for everyone.
"Grab some wood, bub.'" - Richard Nixon, Checkers Speech, abandoned early draft