Star Wars

[Dr. Medulla]

Canadians frighten easily, but they will be back, and in greater numbers...

Don't you mean Mexicans? [/loudobbs]

I mean everyone browner than me. [/Yawkey]

I don't want no darkies or queers in my neighbourhood. [/beaneater]

[Wolter]

Canadians frighten easily, but they will be back, and in greater numbers...

Don't you mean Mexicans? [/loudobbs]

I mean everyone browner than me. [/Yawkey]

I don't want no darkies or queers in my neighbourhood. [/beaneater]

Speaking of racism, I really enjoyed the Zahn notion that the Empire was discriminatory against non-human races. It made the Empire a far more insidious creation, in much the same way that the lameness of the Old Republic of Episodes I-III dilutes the evil by pointing making the formation of the Empire a more or less lateral move. It also granted an additional moral authority to the otherwise nebulous/Platonic notions of the Rebellion. I honestly believe my newly formulated notion of selective self-created canon might lead me to a coherent Star Wars universe that I enjoy without shame.

The notion that the Empire is such a recent creation annoys me immensely, by the way. I had somehow assumed as a child that it was more of an Ancien Regime that had solidified and consolidated power for some time, but it is only like 16-17 years old at the time of Star Wars if one takes those awful first movies as canon. It's much more like the temporary conquests of Alexander of Macedon than a genuine "Empire."

[Dr. Medulla]

The notion that the Empire is such a recent creation annoys me immensely, by the way. I had somehow assumed as a child that it was more of an Ancien Regime that had solidified and consolidated power for some time, but it is only like 16-17 years old at the time of Star Wars if one takes those awful first movies as canon. It's much more like the temporary conquests of Alexander of Macedon than a genuine "Empire."

I had the same experience. The original films made it seem like the Empire was a true thousand year reich, and Luke was the fulfillment of an ancient prophecy. Doesn't seem quite so monstrous given that Castro, for example, lasted more than twice as long. For a storyline that seeks to be epicishly epic, that compressed timeline really does blunt the scope. Most of the people living under the Empire could remember the days of the Republic (rotting as it may have been)—not exactly Nineteen Eighty-Four there.

[Wolter]

The notion that the Empire is such a recent creation annoys me immensely, by the way. I had somehow assumed as a child that it was more of an Ancien Regime that had solidified and consolidated power for some time, but it is only like 16-17 years old at the time of Star Wars if one takes those awful first movies as canon. It's much more like the temporary conquests of Alexander of Macedon than a genuine "Empire."

I had the same experience. The original films made it seem like the Empire was a true thousand year reich, and Luke was the fulfillment of an ancient prophecy. Doesn't seem quite so monstrous given that Castro, for example, lasted more than twice as long. For a storyline that seeks to be epicishly epic, that compressed timeline really does blunt the scope. Most of the people living under the Empire could remember the days of the Republic (rotting as it may have been)—not exactly Nineteen Eighty-Four there.

I'm thinking that Personalized Canon is going to become a facet of Sincere Irony. I don't have the mental energy to fully develop this notion, but saving Star Wars from Lucas would probably give me a psychic boost to help me survive the upcoming FOURTH TURNING.

[eumaas]

The notion that the Empire is such a recent creation annoys me immensely, by the way. I had somehow assumed as a child that it was more of an Ancien Regime that had solidified and consolidated power for some time, but it is only like 16-17 years old at the time of Star Wars if one takes those awful first movies as canon. It's much more like the temporary conquests of Alexander of Macedon than a genuine "Empire."

I had the same experience. The original films made it seem like the Empire was a true thousand year reich, and Luke was the fulfillment of an ancient prophecy. Doesn't seem quite so monstrous given that Castro, for example, lasted more than twice as long. For a storyline that seeks to be epicishly epic, that compressed timeline really does blunt the scope. Most of the people living under the Empire could remember the days of the Republic (rotting as it may have been)—not exactly Nineteen Eighty-Four there.

I'm thinking that Personalized Canon is going to become a facet of Sincere Irony. I don't have the mental energy to fully develop this notion, but saving Star Wars from Lucas would probably give me a psychic boost to help me survive the upcoming FOURTH TURNING.

The what?

[Wolter]

The notion that the Empire is such a recent creation annoys me immensely, by the way. I had somehow assumed as a child that it was more of an Ancien Regime that had solidified and consolidated power for some time, but it is only like 16-17 years old at the time of Star Wars if one takes those awful first movies as canon. It's much more like the temporary conquests of Alexander of Macedon than a genuine "Empire."

I had the same experience. The original films made it seem like the Empire was a true thousand year reich, and Luke was the fulfillment of an ancient prophecy. Doesn't seem quite so monstrous given that Castro, for example, lasted more than twice as long. For a storyline that seeks to be epicishly epic, that compressed timeline really does blunt the scope. Most of the people living under the Empire could remember the days of the Republic (rotting as it may have been)—not exactly Nineteen Eighty-Four there.

I'm thinking that Personalized Canon is going to become a facet of Sincere Irony. I don't have the mental energy to fully develop this notion, but saving Star Wars from Lucas would probably give me a psychic boost to help me survive the upcoming FOURTH TURNING.

The what?

You'll know it when it happens.

[eumaas]

The notion that the Empire is such a recent creation annoys me immensely, by the way. I had somehow assumed as a child that it was more of an Ancien Regime that had solidified and consolidated power for some time, but it is only like 16-17 years old at the time of Star Wars if one takes those awful first movies as canon. It's much more like the temporary conquests of Alexander of Macedon than a genuine "Empire."

I had the same experience. The original films made it seem like the Empire was a true thousand year reich, and Luke was the fulfillment of an ancient prophecy. Doesn't seem quite so monstrous given that Castro, for example, lasted more than twice as long. For a storyline that seeks to be epicishly epic, that compressed timeline really does blunt the scope. Most of the people living under the Empire could remember the days of the Republic (rotting as it may have been)—not exactly Nineteen Eighty-Four there.

I'm thinking that Personalized Canon is going to become a facet of Sincere Irony. I don't have the mental energy to fully develop this notion, but saving Star Wars from Lucas would probably give me a psychic boost to help me survive the upcoming FOURTH TURNING.

The what?

You'll know it when it happens.

The it?

[Wolter]

I had the same experience. The original films made it seem like the Empire was a true thousand year reich, and Luke was the fulfillment of an ancient prophecy. Doesn't seem quite so monstrous given that Castro, for example, lasted more than twice as long. For a storyline that seeks to be epicishly epic, that compressed timeline really does blunt the scope. Most of the people living under the Empire could remember the days of the Republic (rotting as it may have been)—not exactly Nineteen Eighty-Four there.

I'm thinking that Personalized Canon is going to become a facet of Sincere Irony. I don't have the mental energy to fully develop this notion, but saving Star Wars from Lucas would probably give me a psychic boost to help me survive the upcoming FOURTH TURNING.

The what?

You'll know it when it happens.

The it?

Exactly.

[Dr. Medulla]

I'm thinking that Personalized Canon is going to become a facet of Sincere Irony. I don't have the mental energy to fully develop this notion, but saving Star Wars from Lucas would probably give me a psychic boost to help me survive the upcoming FOURTH TURNING.

Arguably we're in the Fourth Turning already—open-ended war, police state-ish tactics, economic turmoil, rejection (maybe) of the old order (Reaganism). I might re-read that one again with an eye on application to current events.

On some level, we all create our own canon when it comes to franchises, fitting and rejecting (or explaining away) aspects according to our interpretations. It might be as simple as saying "I can't watch Attack of the Clones" or be more involved like Flex's efforts to justify Troi's espionage abilities. We aren't passive viewers/readers, so, yeah, the canon can't be external.

[JennyB]

[youtube][/youtube]

[Wolter]

I'm thinking that Personalized Canon is going to become a facet of Sincere Irony. I don't have the mental energy to fully develop this notion, but saving Star Wars from Lucas would probably give me a psychic boost to help me survive the upcoming FOURTH TURNING.

Arguably we're in the Fourth Turning already—open-ended war, police state-ish tactics, economic turmoil, rejection (maybe) of the old order (Reaganism). I might re-read that one again with an eye on application to current events.
On some level, we all create our own canon when it comes to franchises, fitting and rejecting (or explaining away) aspects according to our interpretations. It might be as simple as saying "I can't watch Attack of the Clones" or be more involved like Flex's efforts to justify Troi's espionage abilities. We aren't passive viewers/readers, so, yeah, the canon can't be external.

Actually, I think we are. But phrasing it as prep for upcoming seemed funnier to me in my head.

I just finished listening to that (I forgot I had it for a while). The Q&A at the end made me feel so immature, because both of them had such goofy voices that I had to pause for laughter when they started talking.

[eumaas]

So Fourth Turning is when the little Himmlers of my generation take over and march us all into the oceans on behalf of a great abstraction?

[Dr. Medulla]

I just finished listening to that (I forgot I had it for a while). The Q&A at the end made me feel so immature, because both of them had such goofy voices that I had to pause for laughter when they started talking.

Worse, if I'm remembering correctly, Howe looks a bit like Bill Gates. The audio version is abridged, but when I listened to it I didn't feel like the cuts were detrimental.

Kinda surprising they haven't been all over events of the past five years and released a new edition. I've gone to their board a few times, but it's seemed dweeby intense discussion.

[Flex]

So, if Strauss & Howe are correct (or, more accurately, if I'm reading you guys and Wikipedia correct), there's no real meaningful sense of an unwritten future, right? We're just going to go into the same four cyclical generational patterns ad infinitum and there's no way to every break away from the state or improve society beyond the ebbs and flows of each generation. We're bound up into our generational roles, even if on an individual we don't fit perfectly into a cast role we can't ever - as a society - change beyond those restricted parameters.

That's sort of a bleak worldview where there's not escape from our pre-determined roles. I can see why you'd find it appealing, Doc.

[Wolter]

So, if Strauss & Howe are correct (or, more accurately, if I'm reading you guys and Wikipedia correct), there's no real meaningful sense of an unwritten future, right? We're just going to go into the same four cyclical generational patterns ad infinitum and there's no way to every break away from the state or improve society beyond the ebbs and flows of each generation. We're bound up into our generational roles, even if on an individual we don't fit perfectly into a cast role we can't ever - as a society - change beyond those restricted parameters.

That's sort of a bleak worldview where there's not escape from our pre-determined roles. I can see why you'd find it appealing, Doc.

That's taking it at its most extreme interpretation.