The Future of the Democratic Party

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Dr. Medulla
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Re: The Future of the Democratic Party

Post by Dr. Medulla » 11 Jun 2019, 9:26am

Biden is gonna be this season's Jeb. The number of unforced errors and just oblivious statements—I'm thinking immediately about his recent assertion that the Republican Party will embrace bipartisanship once Trump is gone—are going to add up and add up and add up, and he's going to solidify an image of a clueless gaffe machine. And then the establishment set will start looking for someone else.
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Re: The Future of the Democratic Party

Post by Kory » 11 Jun 2019, 12:22pm

Dr. Medulla wrote:
11 Jun 2019, 9:26am
Biden is gonna be this season's Jeb. The number of unforced errors and just oblivious statements—I'm thinking immediately about his recent assertion that the Republican Party will embrace bipartisanship once Trump is gone—are going to add up and add up and add up, and he's going to solidify an image of a clueless gaffe machine. And then the establishment set will start looking for someone else.
God willing
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Absolutely. Here's another collection of words:

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Re: The Future of the Democratic Party

Post by Flex » 11 Jun 2019, 12:32pm

Dr. Medulla wrote:
11 Jun 2019, 9:26am
Biden is gonna be this season's Jeb. The number of unforced errors and just oblivious statements—I'm thinking immediately about his recent assertion that the Republican Party will embrace bipartisanship once Trump is gone—are going to add up and add up and add up, and he's going to solidify an image of a clueless gaffe machine. And then the establishment set will start looking for someone else.
Maybe. Jeb! was a frontrunner for a little bit, but his ceiling was still like 10 points lower than where Biden is at now (and that's after his announcement surge). Doesn't mean it can't happen, but there's more to tear down.

I also think this underestimates the alliance between the grotesque party elite and the older, whiter, wealthier and more conservative wing of the democratic party. These are folks for whom Biden's "these dang PC kids today" and "women and minorites can't win against trump" are animating concepts. I think we underrate how casually racist and anti-social a huge chunk of the Democratic Party is. Older folks who basically have been brainwashed by the Reagan/Thatcher "there's no such thing as society" shit and are scared of losing their medicare. They might be generally woker than their Republican demographic counterparts, but they're still the embodiment of Ochs' "Love Me, I'm a Liberal" and they're a huge part of the party base that votes in primaries.
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Re: The Future of the Democratic Party

Post by Dr. Medulla » 11 Jun 2019, 2:21pm

Flex wrote:
11 Jun 2019, 12:32pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
11 Jun 2019, 9:26am
Biden is gonna be this season's Jeb. The number of unforced errors and just oblivious statements—I'm thinking immediately about his recent assertion that the Republican Party will embrace bipartisanship once Trump is gone—are going to add up and add up and add up, and he's going to solidify an image of a clueless gaffe machine. And then the establishment set will start looking for someone else.
Maybe. Jeb! was a frontrunner for a little bit, but his ceiling was still like 10 points lower than where Biden is at now (and that's after his announcement surge). Doesn't mean it can't happen, but there's more to tear down.

I also think this underestimates the alliance between the grotesque party elite and the older, whiter, wealthier and more conservative wing of the democratic party. These are folks for whom Biden's "these dang PC kids today" and "women and minorites can't win against trump" are animating concepts. I think we underrate how casually racist and anti-social a huge chunk of the Democratic Party is. Older folks who basically have been brainwashed by the Reagan/Thatcher "there's no such thing as society" shit and are scared of losing their medicare. They might be generally woker than their Republican demographic counterparts, but they're still the embodiment of Ochs' "Love Me, I'm a Liberal" and they're a huge part of the party base that votes in primaries.
I don't disagree with anything that you write, but if Biden gets ensnared in a media narrative where he's a clueless, gaffe-laden grandpa, that pierces the heart of his "most electable" argument. There's somewhat of an Edmund Muskie in '72 to him. He's the frontrunner because he's seen as the guy best able to beat Trump. Behind it all is nothing but faith. If that narrative shifts, he's got little to persuade otherwise. And if he's making dumb, awful, unforced errors now, what's going to happen in the debates when everyone on the stage is gunning for him? The difference between 2016 and 2020 is that there was only one credible establishment candidate; now there's a whole bunch that the old corporate liberals can turn to if Biden loses his aura. Maybe it becomes Harris, maybe Mayor Pete, but the corporatists don't have to stick to Biden lest they get Sanders or Warren. That, I think, is Biden's biggest worry.
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Re: The Future of the Democratic Party

Post by Inder » 11 Jun 2019, 2:22pm

Dr. Medulla wrote:
11 Jun 2019, 2:21pm
if Biden gets ensnared in a media narrative where he's a clueless, gaffe-laden grandpa,

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Re: The Future of the Democratic Party

Post by Dr. Medulla » 11 Jun 2019, 2:28pm

Inder wrote:
11 Jun 2019, 2:22pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
11 Jun 2019, 2:21pm
if Biden gets ensnared in a media narrative where he's a clueless, gaffe-laden grandpa,
That's, like, real?
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Re: The Future of the Democratic Party

Post by Kory » 11 Jun 2019, 5:48pm

Dr. Medulla wrote:
11 Jun 2019, 2:28pm
Inder wrote:
11 Jun 2019, 2:22pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
11 Jun 2019, 2:21pm
if Biden gets ensnared in a media narrative where he's a clueless, gaffe-laden grandpa,
That's, like, real?
The fuck?! Is he trying to channel Kennedy's man on the moon speech?
Inder:
Absolutely. Here's another collection of words:

Table salt (spoon hinge)
Octopus (Ukraine)
St. Petersburg (arms)
Ginger beer (cauliflower)
Pat Sajak (PSak)
Lamp post (self evident)
Florida Timeshare (ditto)
Heraclitus (EMI)
Developers (Developers Developers)
Boogie With Your Children

Dr. Medulla
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Re: The Future of the Democratic Party

Post by Dr. Medulla » 11 Jun 2019, 6:24pm

Kory wrote:
11 Jun 2019, 5:48pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
11 Jun 2019, 2:28pm
Inder wrote:
11 Jun 2019, 2:22pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
11 Jun 2019, 2:21pm
if Biden gets ensnared in a media narrative where he's a clueless, gaffe-laden grandpa,
That's, like, real?
The fuck?! Is he trying to channel Kennedy's man on the moon speech?
And even at that, is that the biggest challenge you can think of? Yeah, of course, no more cancer would be great, but is that where resources should be devoted? There are plenty of bigger, more meaningful, more flat-out existential to tackle before ending cancer. It's certainly suggestive that his audience are those who worry about getting cancer more than the biosphere.
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JennyB
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Re: The Future of the Democratic Party

Post by JennyB » 12 Jun 2019, 11:10am

Kory wrote:
11 Jun 2019, 5:48pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
11 Jun 2019, 2:28pm
Inder wrote:
11 Jun 2019, 2:22pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
11 Jun 2019, 2:21pm
if Biden gets ensnared in a media narrative where he's a clueless, gaffe-laden grandpa,
That's, like, real?
The fuck?! Is he trying to channel Kennedy's man on the moon speech?
Also, didn't Nixon call for this in his campaign? You can see how far we've gotten with that promise. :rolleyes:
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Re: The Future of the Democratic Party

Post by JennyB » 12 Jun 2019, 11:11am

Dr. Medulla wrote:
11 Jun 2019, 6:24pm
Kory wrote:
11 Jun 2019, 5:48pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
11 Jun 2019, 2:28pm
Inder wrote:
11 Jun 2019, 2:22pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
11 Jun 2019, 2:21pm
if Biden gets ensnared in a media narrative where he's a clueless, gaffe-laden grandpa,
That's, like, real?
The fuck?! Is he trying to channel Kennedy's man on the moon speech?
And even at that, is that the biggest challenge you can think of? Yeah, of course, no more cancer would be great, but is that where resources should be devoted? There are plenty of bigger, more meaningful, more flat-out existential to tackle before ending cancer. It's certainly suggestive that his audience are those who worry about getting cancer more than the biosphere.
Ans, also, you can't just "cure cancer." Cancer isn't one disease.
Got a Rake? Sure!

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Don't talk shop.

Dr. Medulla
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Re: The Future of the Democratic Party

Post by Dr. Medulla » 12 Jun 2019, 11:19am

JennyB wrote:
12 Jun 2019, 11:11am
Dr. Medulla wrote:
11 Jun 2019, 6:24pm
Kory wrote:
11 Jun 2019, 5:48pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
11 Jun 2019, 2:28pm
Inder wrote:
11 Jun 2019, 2:22pm


That's, like, real?
The fuck?! Is he trying to channel Kennedy's man on the moon speech?
And even at that, is that the biggest challenge you can think of? Yeah, of course, no more cancer would be great, but is that where resources should be devoted? There are plenty of bigger, more meaningful, more flat-out existential to tackle before ending cancer. It's certainly suggestive that his audience are those who worry about getting cancer more than the biosphere.
Ans, also, you can't just "cure cancer." Cancer isn't one disease.
But if you make the cure good enough, it'll cure them all! Snakeoil, if you will.
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