The Future of the Democratic Party

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Dr. Medulla
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Re: The Future of the Democratic Party

Post by Dr. Medulla » 14 Mar 2019, 9:05pm

Flex wrote:
14 Mar 2019, 8:57pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
14 Mar 2019, 8:36pm
Well, Clinton was also an imperialist corporate liberal who managed to lose to a semi-literate fascist chimp. Rather than spin her as a victim, grant her the respect of being the incompetent monster who was a wretched enough candidate that made Trump a viable candidate.
Also, people forget she ran for president in 2008 and also lost. It's not like Chillary didn't get multiple shots to grab the brass ring.
Further to this, the DNC worked on her behalf against Sanders. She was all but handed the 2016 nomination. Citing sexism it as the catch-all explanation for Hillary's defeat and subsequent reputation is an insult to those who are targeted because they're strong women (e.g., AOC).
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Re: The Future of the Democratic Party

Post by revbob » 14 Mar 2019, 9:22pm

Flex wrote:
14 Mar 2019, 8:57pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
14 Mar 2019, 8:36pm
Well, Clinton was also an imperialist corporate liberal who managed to lose to a semi-literate fascist chimp. Rather than spin her as a victim, grant her the respect of being the incompetent monster who was a wretched enough candidate that made Trump a viable candidate.
Also, people forget she ran for president in 2008 and also lost. It's not like Chillary didn't get multiple shots to grab the brass ring.
And Bernie has served multiple terms in the house and Senate

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Re: The Future of the Democratic Party

Post by BostonBeaneater » 14 Mar 2019, 10:53pm

revbob wrote:
14 Mar 2019, 9:22pm
Flex wrote:
14 Mar 2019, 8:57pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
14 Mar 2019, 8:36pm
Well, Clinton was also an imperialist corporate liberal who managed to lose to a semi-literate fascist chimp. Rather than spin her as a victim, grant her the respect of being the incompetent monster who was a wretched enough candidate that made Trump a viable candidate.
Also, people forget she ran for president in 2008 and also lost. It's not like Chillary didn't get multiple shots to grab the brass ring.
And Bernie has served multiple terms in the house and Senate
I have decided to not give an ounce of support to anyone born before 1965. It’s time for the boomers to sit down.
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Dr. Medulla
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Re: The Future of the Democratic Party

Post by Dr. Medulla » 15 Mar 2019, 6:18am

BostonBeaneater wrote:
14 Mar 2019, 10:53pm
revbob wrote:
14 Mar 2019, 9:22pm
Flex wrote:
14 Mar 2019, 8:57pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
14 Mar 2019, 8:36pm
Well, Clinton was also an imperialist corporate liberal who managed to lose to a semi-literate fascist chimp. Rather than spin her as a victim, grant her the respect of being the incompetent monster who was a wretched enough candidate that made Trump a viable candidate.
Also, people forget she ran for president in 2008 and also lost. It's not like Chillary didn't get multiple shots to grab the brass ring.
And Bernie has served multiple terms in the house and Senate
I have decided to not give an ounce of support to anyone born before 1965. It’s time for the boomers to sit down.
So you're pretty much limited to Gillibrand and Beto. I mean, I fundamentally agree with you that Baby Boomers as the primary agents of digging this hole need to do their part by stopping their digging, but the options are still limited. The good news, tho, is that the young politicians are more likely to reject the consensus of the last 40 years.
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Re: The Future of the Democratic Party

Post by WestwayKid » 15 Mar 2019, 12:38pm

Dr. Medulla wrote:
14 Mar 2019, 8:36pm


Well, Clinton was also an imperialist corporate liberal who managed to lose to a semi-literate fascist chimp. Rather than spin her as a victim, grant her the respect of being the incompetent monster who was a wretched enough candidate that made Trump a viable candidate.
I LOVE this response!
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Re: The Future of the Democratic Party

Post by WestwayKid » 15 Mar 2019, 12:39pm

Dr. Medulla wrote:
14 Mar 2019, 1:48pm
JennyB wrote:
14 Mar 2019, 1:41pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
14 Mar 2019, 1:30pm
Painful dissection of whether Beto's life has been sufficiently punk: https://theslot.jezebel.com/is-beto-a-p ... 1833288379

Even tho it's clearly a fluffy piece, the whole This is Punk and That's Not Punk categorization is wincing.
It makes me feel better though that she's a woman of color. I thought it was pretty funny, but I took exception to her slam on Big Star.
Stuff like his commitment in college to body improvement not being punk—plenty of hardcore scenes emphasize strength and body purity. And punks don't like capitalism? Punks may talk a good game and genuinely loathe corporate capitalism, but, yeah, very few actually hate capitalism.
Rollins would vouch for that as would Danzig! :mrgreen:
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Re: The Future of the Democratic Party

Post by WestwayKid » 15 Mar 2019, 12:40pm

Dr. Medulla wrote:
14 Mar 2019, 8:36pm


Well, Clinton was also an imperialist corporate liberal who managed to lose to a semi-literate fascist chimp. Rather than spin her as a victim, grant her the respect of being the incompetent monster who was a wretched enough candidate that made Trump a viable candidate.
It's also super mind blowing that people hang onto Clinton like she's some sort of lost cause hero. She isn't George McGovern or Walter Mondale. I think many Dems (myself included) are more than happy to see that entire family shuffle off stage...
"If they believed in a place called Kokomo, then so did I." - Michael Edward Love

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Re: The Future of the Democratic Party

Post by BostonBeaneater » 18 Mar 2019, 9:07pm

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Re: The Future of the Democratic Party

Post by matedog » 01 Apr 2019, 12:17pm

This is a pretty brutal take down of Mayor Pete: https://www.currentaffairs.org/2019/03/all-about-pete

I won't lie, I was falling for him as well, but this certainly takes me off the bandwagon.
Look, you have to establish context for these things. And I maintain that unless you appreciate the Fall of Constantinople, the Great Fire of London, and Mickey Mantle's fatalist alcoholism, live Freddy makes no sense. If you want to half-ass it, fine, go call Simon Schama to do the appendix.

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Re: The Future of the Democratic Party

Post by Dr. Medulla » 01 Apr 2019, 12:36pm

matedog wrote:
01 Apr 2019, 12:17pm
This is a pretty brutal take down of Mayor Pete: https://www.currentaffairs.org/2019/03/all-about-pete

I won't lie, I was falling for him as well, but this certainly takes me off the bandwagon.
As Bill Clinton and Barack Obama have taught me (and the author of this piece says), smart guys with solid educations who use their life story as proof that the system works instinctively can't go against that system. Give me someone who has succeeded in spite of the system or realizes that his (because it'll almost always be a man) demographic particulars made it possible in ways that the vast majority would never get.
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Re: The Future of the Democratic Party

Post by coffeepotman » 01 Apr 2019, 12:38pm

WestwayKid wrote:
15 Mar 2019, 12:40pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
14 Mar 2019, 8:36pm


Well, Clinton was also an imperialist corporate liberal who managed to lose to a semi-literate fascist chimp. Rather than spin her as a victim, grant her the respect of being the incompetent monster who was a wretched enough candidate that made Trump a viable candidate.
It's also super mind blowing that people hang onto Clinton like she's some sort of lost cause hero. She isn't George McGovern or Walter Mondale. I think many Dems (myself included) are more than happy to see that entire family shuffle off stage...
I could not agree more, Hillary is the reason that Trump won. Plain and simple

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Re: The Future of the Democratic Party

Post by WestwayKid » 01 Apr 2019, 1:03pm

coffeepotman wrote:
01 Apr 2019, 12:38pm
WestwayKid wrote:
15 Mar 2019, 12:40pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
14 Mar 2019, 8:36pm


Well, Clinton was also an imperialist corporate liberal who managed to lose to a semi-literate fascist chimp. Rather than spin her as a victim, grant her the respect of being the incompetent monster who was a wretched enough candidate that made Trump a viable candidate.
It's also super mind blowing that people hang onto Clinton like she's some sort of lost cause hero. She isn't George McGovern or Walter Mondale. I think many Dems (myself included) are more than happy to see that entire family shuffle off stage...
I could not agree more, Hillary is the reason that Trump won. Plain and simple
This seemed to be Clinton's sole message: Trump is not qualified to be president so how can you vote for him? She didn't factor in that people thought little better of her. If she had been a stronger candidate that logic might have worked...but she (and her team) felt it was enough to just point out that Trump wasn't qualified without doing enough to talk about why she was a better choice. It was a very arrogant approach.
"If they believed in a place called Kokomo, then so did I." - Michael Edward Love

Dr. Medulla
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Re: The Future of the Democratic Party

Post by Dr. Medulla » 01 Apr 2019, 1:23pm

WestwayKid wrote:
01 Apr 2019, 1:03pm
coffeepotman wrote:
01 Apr 2019, 12:38pm
WestwayKid wrote:
15 Mar 2019, 12:40pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
14 Mar 2019, 8:36pm


Well, Clinton was also an imperialist corporate liberal who managed to lose to a semi-literate fascist chimp. Rather than spin her as a victim, grant her the respect of being the incompetent monster who was a wretched enough candidate that made Trump a viable candidate.
It's also super mind blowing that people hang onto Clinton like she's some sort of lost cause hero. She isn't George McGovern or Walter Mondale. I think many Dems (myself included) are more than happy to see that entire family shuffle off stage...
I could not agree more, Hillary is the reason that Trump won. Plain and simple
This seemed to be Clinton's sole message: Trump is not qualified to be president so how can you vote for him? She didn't factor in that people thought little better of her. If she had been a stronger candidate that logic might have worked...but she (and her team) felt it was enough to just point out that Trump wasn't qualified without doing enough to talk about why she was a better choice. It was a very arrogant approach.
She exuded that very liberal quality (which used to be a very Republican quality) of asserting that she was better than you, that you should respect that, and be grateful that she and her thick c.v. are willing to sit in the big chair. What's especially key is that the definition of being better is having a more prestigious education, more money, more connections, more entries on the c.v. There's no way she could demonstrate that she's a more moral person, that she's more motivated by moral outrage, that people with as much ability as she cannot, thru no fault of their own than drawing a weak hand in terms of the race and class of their parents, have the same opportunities as her and that that is fucking appalling. She was the most cold-hearted of technocrats who believed that she was owed the job because of her c.v. Grandma fucking Nixon.
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Re: The Future of the Democratic Party

Post by coffeepotman » 01 Apr 2019, 3:10pm

Tell the truth!

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Re: The Future of the Democratic Party

Post by Flex » 02 Apr 2019, 1:02pm

I've been in a bit of a ranking mood for things lately, so here's my Dem presidential contenders list top 10 (not really weighted towards momentum or probablity, but I do list all the people I think have no shot and so haven't really thought about much below the proverbial fold):

Would affirmatively vote for:
1. Elizabeth Warren
2. Bernie Sanders
3. Stacey Abrams (if she runs she'd be the best centrist-type candidate, imho)

Problematic but gotta do what you gotta do:
4. Kirsten Gillibrand
5. Kamala Harris

Are you fucking kidding me:
6. Amy Klobuchar
7. Beto O'Rourke
8. Cory Booker
9. Mayor Pete

The worst tendencies of the last 20 years of the Democratic Party all in one package:
10. Joe Biden

They're not going to get it, who cares (only listing formally declared and they're mostly pretty bad):
Julian Castro
Jay Inslee
John Hickenlooper
Andrew Yang
John Delaney
Tulsi Gabbard
Marianne Williamson
YOU MADE ONE MISTAKE, LENNON, YOU DOUBLE CROSSED MIKE LOVE AND LEFT HIM ALIVE

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