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Re: The Political Gun Thread

Posted: 26 Dec 2018, 2:19pm
by Dr. Medulla
https://splinternews.com/millions-of-ki ... 1831321991

This is why I believe the US is headed towards gun control over the next several decades. Generally, adults seek to correct for their own children what they found problematic in their own childhood—too much security, too much freedom, too much materialism, too much religion, etc—and taking steps to make childhood less about expecting a lunatic with a gun coming into one's school will be significant cultural and, accordingly, policy shift.

Re: The Political Gun Thread

Posted: 27 Dec 2018, 9:10am
by WestwayKid
Dr. Medulla wrote:
26 Dec 2018, 2:19pm
https://splinternews.com/millions-of-ki ... 1831321991

This is why I believe the US is headed towards gun control over the next several decades. Generally, adults seek to correct for their own children what they found problematic in their own childhood—too much security, too much freedom, too much materialism, too much religion, etc—and taking steps to make childhood less about expecting a lunatic with a gun coming into one's school will be significant cultural and, accordingly, policy shift.
I agree...but sadly it doesn't seem like it will happen soon enough. I have to kids in a public elementary school in the suburbs of Milwaukee. The same school district I attended as a kid. I personally don't lose sleep over the thought of a lunatic with a gun visiting their classroom. There is some willful ignorance involved: it won't happen here, they have made the schools safer, and so on. I do wonder, however, what impact it has on children: school locking down at the slightest perceived threat (this has happened to my kids on more than one occasion), drills to protect themselves if there actually is an active shooter, etc. Do they notice or do they just accept that this is how it has always been?

Re: The Political Gun Thread

Posted: 27 Dec 2018, 9:31am
by Dr. Medulla
WestwayKid wrote:
27 Dec 2018, 9:10am
Dr. Medulla wrote:
26 Dec 2018, 2:19pm
https://splinternews.com/millions-of-ki ... 1831321991

This is why I believe the US is headed towards gun control over the next several decades. Generally, adults seek to correct for their own children what they found problematic in their own childhood—too much security, too much freedom, too much materialism, too much religion, etc—and taking steps to make childhood less about expecting a lunatic with a gun coming into one's school will be significant cultural and, accordingly, policy shift.
I agree...but sadly it doesn't seem like it will happen soon enough. I have to kids in a public elementary school in the suburbs of Milwaukee. The same school district I attended as a kid. I personally don't lose sleep over the thought of a lunatic with a gun visiting their classroom. There is some willful ignorance involved: it won't happen here, they have made the schools safer, and so on. I do wonder, however, what impact it has on children: school locking down at the slightest perceived threat (this has happened to my kids on more than one occasion), drills to protect themselves if there actually is an active shooter, etc. Do they notice or do they just accept that this is how it has always been?
It could become something ingrained as normal except that it runs counter with other cultural programming, which is that childhood is about innocence and joy and being carefree. So it's mixed messages but the latter is a lot more prevalent because it's tied to consumption. Consumer culture, with its promise of happiness through hedonism, has compromised a number of cultural conservative efforts from fulling succeeding, from hard right Christian morality to gun culture paranoia. Eliminate the consumer culture angle and then the paranoid authoritarian stuff has a better chance of taking hold.

Re: The Political Gun Thread

Posted: 25 Mar 2019, 12:53pm
by JennyB
His death is the third suicide in the past week related to school massacres. This country is trash. To be honest, I would probably do the same thing if my child was murdered in a school massacre and then I was harassed by Alex Jones and his minions afterward.

https://www.cnn.com/2019/03/25/us/sandy ... index.html

Re: The Political Gun Thread

Posted: 25 Mar 2019, 1:05pm
by Mimi
JennyB wrote:
25 Mar 2019, 12:53pm
His death is the third suicide in the past week related to school massacres. This country is trash. To be honest, I would probably do the same thing if my child was murdered in a school massacre and then I was harassed by Alex Jones and his minions afterward.

https://www.cnn.com/2019/03/25/us/sandy ... index.html
Aw, damn. I can't even fathom the death of a child, especially a school massacre. :cry:

And Alex Jones can go fuck himself raw.

Re: The Political Gun Thread

Posted: 27 Mar 2019, 9:38pm
by 101Walterton
I posted this 3 years ago and no one agreed with me.
If that had happened in Christchurch less people would be dead.


by 101Walterton » 14 Jun 2016, 1:21pm

In NZ and I am sure US / UK as well, kids have it drummed into them at a very early age what to do in the event of a disaster fire / earthquake, Tsunami etc. with Stop, drop and roll, Stop, cover hold etc.. It is so ingrained it becomes second nature.
Isn't it time there was instruction for mass shooting, suicide shooting etc..
There is no way one man and a gun should be able to shoot over 100 people in a confined space. Now I am not saying kids in classrooms should start running at gunmen but in situations like the nightclub if the crowd immediately descended on the shooter he would not stand a chance. He may at best get off a few shots before he is overpowered.
I can't help but think a lot of these shooters would think twice if they thought the moment they started shooting they would get apprehended by the crowd especially as it takes away their moment of power and glory as they walk around playing god and shooting people.

Re: The Political Gun Thread

Posted: 27 Mar 2019, 10:50pm
by revbob
101Walterton wrote:
27 Mar 2019, 9:38pm
I posted this 3 years ago and no one agreed with me.
If that had happened in Christchurch less people would be dead.


by 101Walterton » 14 Jun 2016, 1:21pm

In NZ and I am sure US / UK as well, kids have it drummed into them at a very early age what to do in the event of a disaster fire / earthquake, Tsunami etc. with Stop, drop and roll, Stop, cover hold etc.. It is so ingrained it becomes second nature.
Isn't it time there was instruction for mass shooting, suicide shooting etc..
There is no way one man and a gun should be able to shoot over 100 people in a confined space. Now I am not saying kids in classrooms should start running at gunmen but in situations like the nightclub if the crowd immediately descended on the shooter he would not stand a chance. He may at best get off a few shots before he is overpowered.
I can't help but think a lot of these shooters would think twice if they thought the moment they started shooting they would get apprehended by the crowd especially as it takes away their moment of power and glory as they walk around playing god and shooting people.
Dont recall the original post. Conventional wisdom in an "active shooter" situation is run/hide first and only confront/fight them as a last resort. I had a coworker who was ex special forces. After many beers he would confide to a degree some of the things he'd been involved in ( he'd killed people and it obviously haunted him) and his advice was the same because most people have no training for such a situation, certainly not kids.

Re: The Political Gun Thread

Posted: 27 Mar 2019, 11:18pm
by 101Walterton
revbob wrote:
27 Mar 2019, 10:50pm
101Walterton wrote:
27 Mar 2019, 9:38pm
I posted this 3 years ago and no one agreed with me.
If that had happened in Christchurch less people would be dead.


by 101Walterton » 14 Jun 2016, 1:21pm

In NZ and I am sure US / UK as well, kids have it drummed into them at a very early age what to do in the event of a disaster fire / earthquake, Tsunami etc. with Stop, drop and roll, Stop, cover hold etc.. It is so ingrained it becomes second nature.
Isn't it time there was instruction for mass shooting, suicide shooting etc..
There is no way one man and a gun should be able to shoot over 100 people in a confined space. Now I am not saying kids in classrooms should start running at gunmen but in situations like the nightclub if the crowd immediately descended on the shooter he would not stand a chance. He may at best get off a few shots before he is overpowered.
I can't help but think a lot of these shooters would think twice if they thought the moment they started shooting they would get apprehended by the crowd especially as it takes away their moment of power and glory as they walk around playing god and shooting people.
Dont recall the original post. Conventional wisdom in an "active shooter" situation is run/hide first and only confront/fight them as a last resort. I had a coworker who was ex special forces. After many beers he would confide to a degree some of the things he'd been involved in ( he'd killed people and it obviously haunted him) and his advice was the same because most people have no training for such a situation, certainly not kids.
If everyone in that mosque ran straight at him as soon as he started shooting he would not have been able to shoot the 100 people shot in Christchurch (which is the exact the number I posted above 3 years ago).
At the very least he would not have been able to get out of the Al Noor Mosque and drive to the Linwood Mosque and murder 7 people.

Re: The Political Gun Thread

Posted: 28 Mar 2019, 5:46am
by revbob
Again I think it is the sort of situation that causes many to act as individuals. Individuals who are most interested in self preservation.

Re: The Political Gun Thread

Posted: 28 Mar 2019, 8:07am
by Mimi
101Walterton wrote:
27 Mar 2019, 9:38pm
I posted this 3 years ago and no one agreed with me.
If that had happened in Christchurch less people would be dead.


by 101Walterton » 14 Jun 2016, 1:21pm

In NZ and I am sure US / UK as well, kids have it drummed into them at a very early age what to do in the event of a disaster fire / earthquake, Tsunami etc. with Stop, drop and roll, Stop, cover hold etc.. It is so ingrained it becomes second nature.
Isn't it time there was instruction for mass shooting, suicide shooting etc..
There is no way one man and a gun should be able to shoot over 100 people in a confined space. Now I am not saying kids in classrooms should start running at gunmen but in situations like the nightclub if the crowd immediately descended on the shooter he would not stand a chance. He may at best get off a few shots before he is overpowered.
I can't help but think a lot of these shooters would think twice if they thought the moment they started shooting they would get apprehended by the crowd especially as it takes away their moment of power and glory as they walk around playing god and shooting people.
I've been in uncomfortable situations with no weapons involved and my first and only thought was flight, not fight. As much as I like to put myself in other's shoes to understand how something might feel, I know I could never really appreciate the fear, adrenaline, and survival response that would happen in an active shooter situation. Most folks are oblivious to their surroundings at the best of times, so being cognizant enough to trace where the bullets are coming from when panic and chaos has already erupted might be close to impossible, especially if your survival instinct has already kicked in. Where are my kids, where's my wife/husband/sister, etc, how do I get out of here, where can I hide?

As for the shooter being deterred? If the gunman is filled with rage or whatever it is that fuels their madness, I doubt a rush of people trying to take him/her down is going to stop the gunfire. If he's using a semi-automatic, anyone who comes within his line of sight is going to die. A surprise attack from behind might work, but that, I imagine, takes some planning. With someone who is already on high alert, any noise or movement is going to trigger them and their finger.

I understand what you're getting at , because my rational response (when I'm not actively in that situation) is to want to fight, but once fear and the survival instinct takes over, my guess is the only thought is to run.

Re: The Political Gun Thread

Posted: 28 Mar 2019, 3:11pm
by 101Walterton
Mimi wrote:
28 Mar 2019, 8:07am
101Walterton wrote:
27 Mar 2019, 9:38pm
I posted this 3 years ago and no one agreed with me.
If that had happened in Christchurch less people would be dead.


by 101Walterton » 14 Jun 2016, 1:21pm

In NZ and I am sure US / UK as well, kids have it drummed into them at a very early age what to do in the event of a disaster fire / earthquake, Tsunami etc. with Stop, drop and roll, Stop, cover hold etc.. It is so ingrained it becomes second nature.
Isn't it time there was instruction for mass shooting, suicide shooting etc..
There is no way one man and a gun should be able to shoot over 100 people in a confined space. Now I am not saying kids in classrooms should start running at gunmen but in situations like the nightclub if the crowd immediately descended on the shooter he would not stand a chance. He may at best get off a few shots before he is overpowered.
I can't help but think a lot of these shooters would think twice if they thought the moment they started shooting they would get apprehended by the crowd especially as it takes away their moment of power and glory as they walk around playing god and shooting people.
I've been in uncomfortable situations with no weapons involved and my first and only thought was flight, not fight. As much as I like to put myself in other's shoes to understand how something might feel, I know I could never really appreciate the fear, adrenaline, and survival response that would happen in an active shooter situation. Most folks are oblivious to their surroundings at the best of times, so being cognizant enough to trace where the bullets are coming from when panic and chaos has already erupted might be close to impossible, especially if your survival instinct has already kicked in. Where are my kids, where's my wife/husband/sister, etc, how do I get out of here, where can I hide?

As for the shooter being deterred? If the gunman is filled with rage or whatever it is that fuels their madness, I doubt a rush of people trying to take him/her down is going to stop the gunfire. If he's using a semi-automatic, anyone who comes within his line of sight is going to die. A surprise attack from behind might work, but that, I imagine, takes some planning. With someone who is already on high alert, any noise or movement is going to trigger them and their finger.

I understand what you're getting at , because my rational response (when I'm not actively in that situation) is to want to fight, but once fear and the survival instinct takes over, my guess is the only thought is to run.
Fair points Mimi and you are correct about individual response that is why I said it is something that needs to be drummed into you from childhood as it is for other situations where what you do goes against natural instinct (earthquake for example).
In the Mosque individuals did rush the gunman and were killed. It needs to be a mob action. People will die but he can’t shoot everyone jumping on him.

Re: The Political Gun Thread

Posted: 11 Apr 2019, 2:08am
by 101Walterton
Just 27 days after the mass shooting in Christchurch and new gun laws have been passed banning semi automatic weapons.
Well done!!

Re: The Political Gun Thread

Posted: 19 Apr 2019, 6:47am
by Dr. Medulla
https://theslot.jezebel.com/the-nra-is- ... 1834140614

But if the NRA dies, who will provide the copypasta that saves gun rights?

Re: The Political Gun Thread

Posted: 03 Aug 2019, 3:43pm
by Mimi
El Paso. :disshame: :cry:

Re: The Political Gun Thread

Posted: 03 Aug 2019, 4:20pm
by BitterTom
Terrible news.