So it's very possible that the more Ska sounding version of "Pressure Drop" remixed by Bill Price for inclusion on the "Black Market Clash" 10" is this version.
Also that WMiHP is the version later released as the RAR version. It would make sense as this version contains the older lyrics "millions of Yen down Japan way".
And "The Prisoner (Alt. Mix)" also from this session. The version I have which is listed as being from "Oct-Nov'77" is this version. It has a different guitar riff finale more in keeping with what was played live in '77.
Leaving the only track not released from this session officially or on bootleg to be the Lee Perry mix of "Complete Control".
I don’t have more specific info, but on a cassette Mick gave me that same alternate mix of The Prisoner is right after an alternate mix of Clash City Rockers. It’s possible they were recorded at the same time or, perhaps more likely, remixed at the same time.
So it's very possible that the more Ska sounding version of "Pressure Drop" remixed by Bill Price for inclusion on the "Black Market Clash" 10" is this version.
Also that WMiHP is the version later released as the RAR version. It would make sense as this version contains the older lyrics "millions of Yen down Japan way".
And "The Prisoner (Alt. Mix)" also from this session. The version I have which is listed as being from "Oct-Nov'77" is this version. It has a different guitar riff finale more in keeping with what was played live in '77.
Leaving the only track not released from this session officially or on bootleg to be the Lee Perry mix of "Complete Control".
I don’t have more specific info, but on a cassette Mick gave me that same alternate mix of The Prisoner is right after an alternate mix of Clash City Rockers. It’s possible they were recorded at the same time or, perhaps more likely, remixed at the same time.
That's very interesting indeed. On all the bootlegs and listings I have it states Oct' - Nov' '77 the date of the "Clash City Rockers" session.
Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty
We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.
And "The Prisoner (Alt. Mix)" also from this session. The version I have which is listed as being from "Oct-Nov'77" is this version. It has a different guitar riff finale more in keeping with what was played live in '77.
I remember how wild it was listening to the SMBC version of Prisoner on headphones the first time and finding it still has that guitar riff at the end, it's just buried under the louder solo.
And "The Prisoner (Alt. Mix)" also from this session. The version I have which is listed as being from "Oct-Nov'77" is this version. It has a different guitar riff finale more in keeping with what was played live in '77.
I remember how wild it was listening to the SMBC version of Prisoner on headphones the first time and finding it still has that guitar riff at the end, it's just buried under the louder solo.
Yep that's it. On this earlier take/mix it's reversed you can hear that guitar solo buried under the riff.
Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty
We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.
I think River means the vocal harmony on the chorus, "after all this time etc", I'm sure I once read it was Topper.
And I thought the "judgement day" bits were Den Hegarty from Darts? Mick may also have backed those bits up as they are harmonised, but the very low part sounds too deep for Mick's tenor voice.
Ahh yep gotcha.. the harmonised "judgement day" do indeed sound like Mick and Den to my ears. And those backing vocals on the "after all this time" do indeed sound like Topper. It's not Tymon as there is no wavering in the vocal.
Not worth it Dave. It's not anything you would want to keep. Just a quick knock up to empathize the vocal. Not a good mix for keeping as I only did it to hear the vocal.
I didn't even keep it myself as it's a throwaway mix. You've missed nothing.
Can hear it a little better here:
I never noticed the drum flub up about 1:36.
Look, you have to establish context for these things. And I maintain that unless you appreciate the Fall of Constantinople, the Great Fire of London, and Mickey Mantle's fatalist alcoholism, live Freddy makes no sense. If you want to half-ass it, fine, go call Simon Schama to do the appendix.
I think River means the vocal harmony on the chorus, "after all this time etc", I'm sure I once read it was Topper.
And I thought the "judgement day" bits were Den Hegarty from Darts? Mick may also have backed those bits up as they are harmonised, but the very low part sounds too deep for Mick's tenor voice.
Ahh yep gotcha.. the harmonised "judgement day" do indeed sound like Mick and Den to my ears. And those backing vocals on the "after all this time" do indeed sound like Topper. It's not Tymon as there is no wavering in the vocal.
Not worth it Dave. It's not anything you would want to keep. Just a quick knock up to empathize the vocal. Not a good mix for keeping as I only did it to hear the vocal.
I didn't even keep it myself as it's a throwaway mix. You've missed nothing.
Can hear it a little better here:
I never noticed the drum flub up about 1:36.
Never really paid that much attention to the backing harmony on the chorus, but listening to that it does sound more tymony that toppery to me tbh. Maybe even Ellen. Could be wrong though, very difficult to be sure.
Ahh yep gotcha.. the harmonised "judgement day" do indeed sound like Mick and Den to my ears. And those backing vocals on the "after all this time" do indeed sound like Topper. It's not Tymon as there is no wavering in the vocal.
Not worth it Dave. It's not anything you would want to keep. Just a quick knock up to empathize the vocal. Not a good mix for keeping as I only did it to hear the vocal.
I didn't even keep it myself as it's a throwaway mix. You've missed nothing.
Can hear it a little better here:
I never noticed the drum flub up about 1:36.
Never really paid that much attention to the backing harmony on the chorus, but listening to that it does sound more tymony that toppery to me tbh. Maybe even Ellen. Could be wrong though, very difficult to be sure.
Surely that shoul be "elleny".
Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty
We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.
I think River means the vocal harmony on the chorus, "after all this time etc", I'm sure I once read it was Topper.
And I thought the "judgement day" bits were Den Hegarty from Darts? Mick may also have backed those bits up as they are harmonised, but the very low part sounds too deep for Mick's tenor voice.
Ahh yep gotcha.. the harmonised "judgement day" do indeed sound like Mick and Den to my ears. And those backing vocals on the "after all this time" do indeed sound like Topper. It's not Tymon as there is no wavering in the vocal.
Not worth it Dave. It's not anything you would want to keep. Just a quick knock up to empathize the vocal. Not a good mix for keeping as I only did it to hear the vocal.
I didn't even keep it myself as it's a throwaway mix. You've missed nothing.
Can hear it a little better here:
I never noticed the drum flub up about 1:36.
I think that "drum flub" is more a case of the software used for the extraction. Often it creates distortions.
I still think those bv's are Topper.
Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty
We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.
Not worth it Dave. It's not anything you would want to keep. Just a quick knock up to empathize the vocal. Not a good mix for keeping as I only did it to hear the vocal.
I didn't even keep it myself as it's a throwaway mix. You've missed nothing.
Can hear it a little better here:
I never noticed the drum flub up about 1:36.
Never really paid that much attention to the backing harmony on the chorus, but listening to that it does sound more tymony that toppery to me tbh. Maybe even Ellen. Could be wrong though, very difficult to be sure.
Ahh yep gotcha.. the harmonised "judgement day" do indeed sound like Mick and Den to my ears. And those backing vocals on the "after all this time" do indeed sound like Topper. It's not Tymon as there is no wavering in the vocal.
Not worth it Dave. It's not anything you would want to keep. Just a quick knock up to empathize the vocal. Not a good mix for keeping as I only did it to hear the vocal.
I didn't even keep it myself as it's a throwaway mix. You've missed nothing.
Can hear it a little better here:
I never noticed the drum flub up about 1:36.
I think that "drum flub" is more a case of the software used for the extraction. Often it creates distortions.
I still think those bv's are Topper.
Agreed it still sounds like Topper to me.
I think the hits are actually a little off after relistening to the regular version. SoS is very weirdly mixed. The backing vocals (not Topper's harmonies, the "judgement day" parts) are by far the loudest in the mix, even louder than Joe. The drums are super low. Sounds like bass, piano, and acoustic guitar otherwise. No wonder it sounded so different live.
Look, you have to establish context for these things. And I maintain that unless you appreciate the Fall of Constantinople, the Great Fire of London, and Mickey Mantle's fatalist alcoholism, live Freddy makes no sense. If you want to half-ass it, fine, go call Simon Schama to do the appendix.
Not worth it Dave. It's not anything you would want to keep. Just a quick knock up to empathize the vocal. Not a good mix for keeping as I only did it to hear the vocal.
I didn't even keep it myself as it's a throwaway mix. You've missed nothing.
Can hear it a little better here:
I never noticed the drum flub up about 1:36.
I think that "drum flub" is more a case of the software used for the extraction. Often it creates distortions.
I still think those bv's are Topper.
Agreed it still sounds like Topper to me.
I think the hits are actually a little off after relistening to the regular version. SoS is very weirdly mixed. The backing vocals (not Topper's harmonies, the "judgement day" parts) are by far the loudest in the mix, even louder than Joe. The drums are super low. Sounds like bass, piano, and acoustic guitar otherwise. No wonder it sounded so different live.
Another reason it sounded so different live was because they dropped the key by 5 steps.
There's a tiny, tiny hopeful part of me that says you guys are running a Kaufmanesque long con on the board
Not worth it Dave. It's not anything you would want to keep. Just a quick knock up to empathize the vocal. Not a good mix for keeping as I only did it to hear the vocal.
I didn't even keep it myself as it's a throwaway mix. You've missed nothing.
Can hear it a little better here:
I never noticed the drum flub up about 1:36.
I think that "drum flub" is more a case of the software used for the extraction. Often it creates distortions.
I still think those bv's are Topper.
Agreed it still sounds like Topper to me.
I think the hits are actually a little off after relistening to the regular version. SoS is very weirdly mixed. The backing vocals (not Topper's harmonies, the "judgement day" parts) are by far the loudest in the mix, even louder than Joe. The drums are super low. Sounds like bass, piano, and acoustic guitar otherwise. No wonder it sounded so different live.
Yeah the uploader might not have checked the speed adjustment against a digital source.
Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty
We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.
Not worth it Dave. It's not anything you would want to keep. Just a quick knock up to empathize the vocal. Not a good mix for keeping as I only did it to hear the vocal.
I didn't even keep it myself as it's a throwaway mix. You've missed nothing.
Can hear it a little better here:
I never noticed the drum flub up about 1:36.
I think that "drum flub" is more a case of the software used for the extraction. Often it creates distortions.
I still think those bv's are Topper.
Agreed it still sounds like Topper to me.
I think the hits are actually a little off after relistening to the regular version. SoS is very weirdly mixed. The backing vocals (not Topper's harmonies, the "judgement day" parts) are by far the loudest in the mix, even louder than Joe. The drums are super low. Sounds like bass, piano, and acoustic guitar otherwise. No wonder it sounded so different live.
Another reason it sounded so different live was because they dropped the key by 5 steps.
Sounds like it goes from D on the record to A live?
Look, you have to establish context for these things. And I maintain that unless you appreciate the Fall of Constantinople, the Great Fire of London, and Mickey Mantle's fatalist alcoholism, live Freddy makes no sense. If you want to half-ass it, fine, go call Simon Schama to do the appendix.
I think that "drum flub" is more a case of the software used for the extraction. Often it creates distortions.
I still think those bv's are Topper.
Agreed it still sounds like Topper to me.
I think the hits are actually a little off after relistening to the regular version. SoS is very weirdly mixed. The backing vocals (not Topper's harmonies, the "judgement day" parts) are by far the loudest in the mix, even louder than Joe. The drums are super low. Sounds like bass, piano, and acoustic guitar otherwise. No wonder it sounded so different live.
Another reason it sounded so different live was because they dropped the key by 5 steps.
Sounds like it goes from D on the record to A live?
Correct. Kind of the opposite to Spanish Bombs which goes from A on the record to D live.
There's a tiny, tiny hopeful part of me that says you guys are running a Kaufmanesque long con on the board
I fleshed out the Sandinista and Combat Rock sessions based on info from Clash FAQ including what songs Norman Watt Roy played on. I think I captured all of Marky's notes from previous posts on this thread for these sessions.
I still have to review the 77/78 comments from Marky.
Look, you have to establish context for these things. And I maintain that unless you appreciate the Fall of Constantinople, the Great Fire of London, and Mickey Mantle's fatalist alcoholism, live Freddy makes no sense. If you want to half-ass it, fine, go call Simon Schama to do the appendix.