What did the Clash think of Joy Division/the Post Punk Scene

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Re: What did the Clash think of Joy Division/the Post Punk Scene

Post by Low Down Low »

Kory wrote:
03 Apr 2021, 5:02pm
Low Down Low wrote:
03 Apr 2021, 3:59pm
RockNRollWhore wrote:
03 Apr 2021, 3:19pm
I've often wonder what they thought of Britpop as well. Perhaps Joe Strummer thought Liam Gallagher was a bit of a dunce? Or working class hero?
Would guess he was ok with it, or at least albarn, pulp etc anyway. And doing England's irie and hanging out with Keith Allen and that crowd, wouldn't have thought that was a million miles from the whole britpop scene tbh.
And Antony Genn, of course.
Of course, and I'd say bar tymon, most of the mescaleroes probably had their initial musical roots in britpop one way or another. So whatever about the rest of the clash, you'd have to think joe at least was comfortable with it anyway.

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Re: What did the Clash think of Joy Division/the Post Punk Scene

Post by Marky Dread »

Low Down Low wrote:
03 Apr 2021, 5:19pm
Kory wrote:
03 Apr 2021, 5:02pm
Low Down Low wrote:
03 Apr 2021, 3:59pm
RockNRollWhore wrote:
03 Apr 2021, 3:19pm
I've often wonder what they thought of Britpop as well. Perhaps Joe Strummer thought Liam Gallagher was a bit of a dunce? Or working class hero?
Would guess he was ok with it, or at least albarn, pulp etc anyway. And doing England's irie and hanging out with Keith Allen and that crowd, wouldn't have thought that was a million miles from the whole britpop scene tbh.
And Antony Genn, of course.
Of course, and I'd say bar tymon, most of the mescaleroes probably had their initial musical roots in britpop one way or another. So whatever about the rest of the clash, you'd have to think joe at least was comfortable with it anyway.
Funnily enough Tymon (Timon) Dogg was the original britpopper.



"The Bitter Thoughts of Little Jane" featuring then-session musicians Jimmy Page and John Paul Jones. Moving to Apple Records, Dogg recorded tracks produced by Peter Asher featuring Paul McCartney on piano and James Taylor on guitar.
Last edited by Marky Dread on 03 Apr 2021, 7:21pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: What did the Clash think of Joy Division/the Post Punk Scene

Post by Wolter »

RockNRollWhore wrote:
03 Apr 2021, 1:43pm
Inder wrote:
03 Apr 2021, 1:34pm
I'd put Down in Albion up there with the first two Libs albums — glad Pete stuck with his guns (Mick) and sacked the rest of the band temporarily when they tried to get a pop producer in for the single. Love the whole sonic "scoop" vibe the album has.

While I'm at it:

- Blinding EP is fantastic
- Shotter's Nation is like a D- album for me, though it has some good tunes.
- Really love Grace/Wastelands.
- Sequel to the Prequel is a B+, love some stuff, other stuff is way too samey
- Hamburg Demonstrations is like C+/B, some great stuff, other great stuff that had the life sucked out of it on record (ie: Down for the Outing)
- haven't listened attentively to the Puta Madres stuff, but I liked it well enough

- Waterloo to Anywhere was goodish, we have someone here who could probably chime in on where Deadwood came from...
- Hugely diminishing returns the rest of the way from Carl. Really nice to his fans the couple of times I saw him.


Apparently Pete is a huge Manics fan... lol
Yeah he still manages a few good tunes per record. Gary Powell was the most underrated piece of that band though. What a fucking powerhouse drummer
Christ that cover hurt my ears.
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Re: What did the Clash think of Joy Division/the Post Punk Scene

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I remember an interview in which Noel Gallagher said that nothing else comes even remotely close to Never Mind the Bollocks in the punk genre. He's an odd one to figure out. Slags off a bunch of music for being "too soft" or "too arty" bleh bleh bleh, yet absolutely adores the Smiths, the Cure, Echo and the Bunnymen, and New Order... Can someone please explain lad culture to me? Because I for one cannot even begin to fathom that dichotomy. Football hooligans listening to Indie Rock... fuck me.

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Re: What did the Clash think of Joy Division/the Post Punk Scene

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RockNRollWhore wrote:
03 Apr 2021, 7:51pm
I remember an interview in which Noel Gallagher said that nothing else comes even remotely close to Never Mind the Bollocks in the punk genre. He's an odd one to figure out. Slags off a bunch of music for being "too soft" or "too arty" bleh bleh bleh, yet absolutely adores the Smiths, the Cure, Echo and the Bunnymen, and New Order... Can someone please explain lad culture to me? Because I for one cannot even begin to fathom that dichotomy. Football hooligans listening to Indie Rock... fuck me.

To quote a Doherty song title, Hooligans on E. The Libertines also cut it with Mick for the second album but it wasn’t released.

That cover of Motorcycle Emptiness is shocking.

Mostly agree with Inder’s discussion of the Libs oeuvre, though I’ve never liked anything as much as the stuff Mick worked on.

I was surprised when Carl wrote a song called Deadwood, Good man.
Last edited by TeddyB Not Logged In on 03 Apr 2021, 8:10pm, edited 5 times in total.

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Re: What did the Clash think of Joy Division/the Post Punk Scene

Post by gkbill »

Inder wrote:
03 Apr 2021, 1:34pm
I'd put Down in Albion up there with the first two Libs albums — glad Pete stuck with his guns (Mick) and sacked the rest of the band temporarily when they tried to get a pop producer in for the single. Love the whole sonic "scoop" vibe the album has.

While I'm at it:

- Blinding EP is fantastic
- Shotter's Nation is like a D- album for me, though it has some good tunes.
- Really love Grace/Wastelands.
- Sequel to the Prequel is a B+, love some stuff, other stuff is way too samey
- Hamburg Demonstrations is like C+/B, some great stuff, other great stuff that had the life sucked out of it on record (ie: Down for the Outing)
- haven't listened attentively to the Puta Madres stuff, but I liked it well enough

- Waterloo to Anywhere was goodish, we have someone here who could probably chime in on where Deadwood came from...
- Hugely diminishing returns the rest of the way from Carl. Really nice to his fans the couple of times I saw him.
Hello,

I apologize for this late note but I really like Waterloo to Anywhere. I probably have listened to that as much if not more than any Libertines stuff - it's great to use as a workout listen plus this stays with me: "No one gives a f*** about the values I would die for".

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Re: What did the Clash think of Joy Division/the Post Punk Scene

Post by matedog »

RockNRollWhore wrote:
02 Apr 2021, 9:21pm
I know I’m going to get a ton of hate for this but that’s why I love the Libertines. They got much more close to the musical essence of the Clash than any of the 90s punk revivalists like Rancid...


Listen to the morse code guitar. It’s so warm and comfy sounding. I know I probably sound pedantic as fuck right now but I think I’m onto something.
I just wish they did anything else that was half as good as Can’t Stand Me Now.
Look, you have to establish context for these things. And I maintain that unless you appreciate the Fall of Constantinople, the Great Fire of London, and Mickey Mantle's fatalist alcoholism, live Freddy makes no sense. If you want to half-ass it, fine, go call Simon Schama to do the appendix.

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Re: What did the Clash think of Joy Division/the Post Punk Scene

Post by RockNRollWhore »

matedog wrote:
03 Apr 2021, 8:28pm
RockNRollWhore wrote:
02 Apr 2021, 9:21pm
I know I’m going to get a ton of hate for this but that’s why I love the Libertines. They got much more close to the musical essence of the Clash than any of the 90s punk revivalists like Rancid...


Listen to the morse code guitar. It’s so warm and comfy sounding. I know I probably sound pedantic as fuck right now but I think I’m onto something.
I just wish they did anything else that was half as good as Can’t Stand Me Now.
Don't look back into the sun
Time for Heroes
Boys in the Band
Good old Days
You're my Waterloo
What Katie Did
Music When the Lights go out

Idk they only released two albums proper while at their youthful peak. I think they have plenty of anthems between those two

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Re: What did the Clash think of Joy Division/the Post Punk Scene

Post by Marky Dread »

RockNRollWhore wrote:
03 Apr 2021, 7:51pm
I remember an interview in which Noel Gallagher said that nothing else comes even remotely close to Never Mind the Bollocks in the punk genre. He's an odd one to figure out. Slags off a bunch of music for being "too soft" or "too arty" bleh bleh bleh, yet absolutely adores the Smiths, the Cure, Echo and the Bunnymen, and New Order... Can someone please explain lad culture to me? Because I for one cannot even begin to fathom that dichotomy. Football hooligans listening to Indie Rock... fuck me.
Football hooligans in the early 70s listened to T. Rex/Slade/The Sweet/Mott the Hoople. Then the punk bands and then some of the Indie bands you mentioned onto the baggy scene with The Stone Roses/Happy Mondays etc. Football hooligans had developed a big liking for clothes/drugs etc. It wasn't just a case of turning up for a ruck. They would wear very expensive clothes like Stone Island. If you don't get it you never will.
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Re: What did the Clash think of Joy Division/the Post Punk Scene

Post by RockNRollWhore »

Marky Dread wrote:
03 Apr 2021, 8:40pm
RockNRollWhore wrote:
03 Apr 2021, 7:51pm
I remember an interview in which Noel Gallagher said that nothing else comes even remotely close to Never Mind the Bollocks in the punk genre. He's an odd one to figure out. Slags off a bunch of music for being "too soft" or "too arty" bleh bleh bleh, yet absolutely adores the Smiths, the Cure, Echo and the Bunnymen, and New Order... Can someone please explain lad culture to me? Because I for one cannot even begin to fathom that dichotomy. Football hooligans listening to Indie Rock... fuck me.
Football hooligans in the early 70s listened to T. Rex/Slade/The Sweet/Mott the Hoople. Then the punk bands and then some of the Indie bands you mentioned onto the baggy scene with The Stone Roses/Happy Mondays etc. Football hooligans had developed a big liking for clothes/drugs etc. It wasn't just a case of turning up for a ruck. They would wear very expensive clothes like Stone Island. If you don't get it you never will.
I grew up in the US... so probably not. I must concede then that the average person in England is ten times more cultured than your average American. At least when it pertains to musical taste. The chart topping success of Radiohead and The Manics validates that I believe.

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Re: What did the Clash think of Joy Division/the Post Punk Scene

Post by Marky Dread »

RockNRollWhore wrote:
03 Apr 2021, 8:44pm
Marky Dread wrote:
03 Apr 2021, 8:40pm
RockNRollWhore wrote:
03 Apr 2021, 7:51pm
I remember an interview in which Noel Gallagher said that nothing else comes even remotely close to Never Mind the Bollocks in the punk genre. He's an odd one to figure out. Slags off a bunch of music for being "too soft" or "too arty" bleh bleh bleh, yet absolutely adores the Smiths, the Cure, Echo and the Bunnymen, and New Order... Can someone please explain lad culture to me? Because I for one cannot even begin to fathom that dichotomy. Football hooligans listening to Indie Rock... fuck me.
Football hooligans in the early 70s listened to T. Rex/Slade/The Sweet/Mott the Hoople. Then the punk bands and then some of the Indie bands you mentioned onto the baggy scene with The Stone Roses/Happy Mondays etc. Football hooligans had developed a big liking for clothes/drugs etc. It wasn't just a case of turning up for a ruck. They would wear very expensive clothes like Stone Island. If you don't get it you never will.
I grew up in the US... so probably not. I must concede then that the average person in England is ten times more cultured than your average American. At least when it pertains to musical taste. The chart topping success of Radiohead and The Manics validates that I believe.
Ha I dunno about cultured. I've been involved in stuff that would make your toes curl. Behaviour I've long since been ashamed of. But you can't change the past sadly, just try to be a better person.
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Re: What did the Clash think of Joy Division/the Post Punk Scene

Post by RockNRollWhore »

Marky Dread wrote:
03 Apr 2021, 8:48pm
RockNRollWhore wrote:
03 Apr 2021, 8:44pm
Marky Dread wrote:
03 Apr 2021, 8:40pm
RockNRollWhore wrote:
03 Apr 2021, 7:51pm
I remember an interview in which Noel Gallagher said that nothing else comes even remotely close to Never Mind the Bollocks in the punk genre. He's an odd one to figure out. Slags off a bunch of music for being "too soft" or "too arty" bleh bleh bleh, yet absolutely adores the Smiths, the Cure, Echo and the Bunnymen, and New Order... Can someone please explain lad culture to me? Because I for one cannot even begin to fathom that dichotomy. Football hooligans listening to Indie Rock... fuck me.
Football hooligans in the early 70s listened to T. Rex/Slade/The Sweet/Mott the Hoople. Then the punk bands and then some of the Indie bands you mentioned onto the baggy scene with The Stone Roses/Happy Mondays etc. Football hooligans had developed a big liking for clothes/drugs etc. It wasn't just a case of turning up for a ruck. They would wear very expensive clothes like Stone Island. If you don't get it you never will.
I grew up in the US... so probably not. I must concede then that the average person in England is ten times more cultured than your average American. At least when it pertains to musical taste. The chart topping success of Radiohead and The Manics validates that I believe.
Ha I dunno about cultured. I've been involved in stuff that would make your toes curl. Behaviour I've long since been ashamed of. But you can't change the past sadly, just try to be a better person.
Listening to Snow Patrol?

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Re: What did the Clash think of Joy Division/the Post Punk Scene

Post by Marky Dread »

RockNRollWhore wrote:
03 Apr 2021, 8:53pm
Marky Dread wrote:
03 Apr 2021, 8:48pm
RockNRollWhore wrote:
03 Apr 2021, 8:44pm
Marky Dread wrote:
03 Apr 2021, 8:40pm
RockNRollWhore wrote:
03 Apr 2021, 7:51pm
I remember an interview in which Noel Gallagher said that nothing else comes even remotely close to Never Mind the Bollocks in the punk genre. He's an odd one to figure out. Slags off a bunch of music for being "too soft" or "too arty" bleh bleh bleh, yet absolutely adores the Smiths, the Cure, Echo and the Bunnymen, and New Order... Can someone please explain lad culture to me? Because I for one cannot even begin to fathom that dichotomy. Football hooligans listening to Indie Rock... fuck me.
Football hooligans in the early 70s listened to T. Rex/Slade/The Sweet/Mott the Hoople. Then the punk bands and then some of the Indie bands you mentioned onto the baggy scene with The Stone Roses/Happy Mondays etc. Football hooligans had developed a big liking for clothes/drugs etc. It wasn't just a case of turning up for a ruck. They would wear very expensive clothes like Stone Island. If you don't get it you never will.
I grew up in the US... so probably not. I must concede then that the average person in England is ten times more cultured than your average American. At least when it pertains to musical taste. The chart topping success of Radiohead and The Manics validates that I believe.
Ha I dunno about cultured. I've been involved in stuff that would make your toes curl. Behaviour I've long since been ashamed of. But you can't change the past sadly, just try to be a better person.
Listening to Snow Patrol?
Well my young droogie after a bit of ultra violence it was more like being chased by a Police Patrol. ;)
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Re: What did the Clash think of Joy Division/the Post Punk Scene

Post by Inder »

Dockers has it covered:


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Re: What did the Clash think of Joy Division/the Post Punk Scene

Post by Kory »

Inder wrote:
03 Apr 2021, 11:08pm
Dockers has it covered:

As per usual
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