Ugh. That's like the lamest opinion ever offered here.
God Tier GEER version
- Dr. Medulla
- Atheistic Epileptic
- Posts: 116665
- Joined: 15 Jun 2008, 2:00pm
- Location: Straight Banana, Idaho
Re: God Tier GEER version
"I used to bullseye womp rats in my T-16 back in Whittier, they're not much bigger than two meters.'" - Richard Nixon, Checkers Speech, abandoned early draft
- Marky Dread
- Messiah of the Milk Bar
- Posts: 59024
- Joined: 17 Jun 2008, 11:26am
Re: God Tier GEER version
Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty
We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.
"Without the common people you're nothing"
Nos Sumus Una Familia
Re: God Tier GEER version
As I recall, this is Matey's assessment as well. He dislikes all the songs ending with interminable outros, and (I think) also dislikes that there are too many guitar solos instead of distinct sections on many songs.Mark^Bastard wrote: ↑29 Jun 2022, 11:59pmI've come to the conclusion that the songs are all actually good. The problem is that they're needlessly long so there's only 10 of them,
"Suck our Earth dick, Martians!" —Doc
Re: God Tier GEER version
That's definitely what I've said. I relistened last week and some interesting chord changes and rhythm changes caught my ear as a natural extension of some of the same from the first album, but more evolved I suppose. Some outros are more interesting than I give credit for (ATYP for example). I've bitched about some of the production choices (double tracking Joe on ECW), but also some arrangements are a bit misguided, like the sax on DST doesn't do much for me. The live version with Mick's leads are way better to my ears.Kory wrote: ↑01 Jul 2022, 2:41pmAs I recall, this is Matey's assessment as well. He dislikes all the songs ending with interminable outros, and (I think) also dislikes that there are too many guitar solos instead of distinct sections on many songs.Mark^Bastard wrote: ↑29 Jun 2022, 11:59pmI've come to the conclusion that the songs are all actually good. The problem is that they're needlessly long so there's only 10 of them,
I guess the constant guitar noodling throughout the album doesn't serve to elevate the songs as they should, for the most part. Like Guns on the Roof has this great break down/build up to this limp guitar solo. The outro vocals are kinda fun, but just kinda peters out with the noodling trailing off.
I don't know. I try to love GEER periodically and I wish I could better and more accurately ascertain why it has never moved me. SEH and TG are probably top 5 Clash songs for me. It's like they took all their best ideas at the time and put them in those two songs.
Look, you have to establish context for these things. And I maintain that unless you appreciate the Fall of Constantinople, the Great Fire of London, and Mickey Mantle's fatalist alcoholism, live Freddy makes no sense. If you want to half-ass it, fine, go call Simon Schama to do the appendix.
Re: God Tier GEER version
Yeah it's pretty definitively a "difficult second album." Of course, that designation for a band like the Clash means it's still a world beater but you can definitely catch a whiff of aimlessness to it aside from the really constructed songs like SEH and SF. Tommy Gun to me has always seemed a little half-baked, even.matedog wrote: ↑01 Jul 2022, 5:26pmThat's definitely what I've said. I relistened last week and some interesting chord changes and rhythm changes caught my ear as a natural extension of some of the same from the first album, but more evolved I suppose. Some outros are more interesting than I give credit for (ATYP for example). I've bitched about some of the production choices (double tracking Joe on ECW), but also some arrangements are a bit misguided, like the sax on DST doesn't do much for me. The live version with Mick's leads are way better to my ears.Kory wrote: ↑01 Jul 2022, 2:41pmAs I recall, this is Matey's assessment as well. He dislikes all the songs ending with interminable outros, and (I think) also dislikes that there are too many guitar solos instead of distinct sections on many songs.Mark^Bastard wrote: ↑29 Jun 2022, 11:59pmI've come to the conclusion that the songs are all actually good. The problem is that they're needlessly long so there's only 10 of them,
I guess the constant guitar noodling throughout the album doesn't serve to elevate the songs as they should, for the most part. Like Guns on the Roof has this great break down/build up to this limp guitar solo. The outro vocals are kinda fun, but just kinda peters out with the noodling trailing off.
I don't know. I try to love GEER periodically and I wish I could better and more accurately ascertain why it has never moved me. SEH and TG are probably top 5 Clash songs for me. It's like they took all their best ideas at the time and put them in those two songs.
"Suck our Earth dick, Martians!" —Doc
- Marky Dread
- Messiah of the Milk Bar
- Posts: 59024
- Joined: 17 Jun 2008, 11:26am
Re: God Tier GEER version
Whatever happened to ZoroasterTheCat?
Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty
We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.
"Without the common people you're nothing"
Nos Sumus Una Familia
Re: God Tier GEER version
Pretty impressive single post, got a good reaction.
- Marky Dread
- Messiah of the Milk Bar
- Posts: 59024
- Joined: 17 Jun 2008, 11:26am
Re: God Tier GEER version
Two posts I think.
Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty
We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.
"Without the common people you're nothing"
Nos Sumus Una Familia
-
Mark^Bastard
- Sightsee MC
- Posts: 281
- Joined: 15 Jan 2009, 2:01am
Re: God Tier GEER version
The problem with Tommy Gun is the drum blasting leading into that drawn out "tommm-mmy gun". The lyrics/vocals (the arrangement, not the performance) let it down imo.Kory wrote: ↑01 Jul 2022, 6:34pmYeah it's pretty definitively a "difficult second album." Of course, that designation for a band like the Clash means it's still a world beater but you can definitely catch a whiff of aimlessness to it aside from the really constructed songs like SEH and SF. Tommy Gun to me has always seemed a little half-baked, even.matedog wrote: ↑01 Jul 2022, 5:26pmThat's definitely what I've said. I relistened last week and some interesting chord changes and rhythm changes caught my ear as a natural extension of some of the same from the first album, but more evolved I suppose. Some outros are more interesting than I give credit for (ATYP for example). I've bitched about some of the production choices (double tracking Joe on ECW), but also some arrangements are a bit misguided, like the sax on DST doesn't do much for me. The live version with Mick's leads are way better to my ears.Kory wrote: ↑01 Jul 2022, 2:41pmAs I recall, this is Matey's assessment as well. He dislikes all the songs ending with interminable outros, and (I think) also dislikes that there are too many guitar solos instead of distinct sections on many songs.Mark^Bastard wrote: ↑29 Jun 2022, 11:59pmI've come to the conclusion that the songs are all actually good. The problem is that they're needlessly long so there's only 10 of them,
I guess the constant guitar noodling throughout the album doesn't serve to elevate the songs as they should, for the most part. Like Guns on the Roof has this great break down/build up to this limp guitar solo. The outro vocals are kinda fun, but just kinda peters out with the noodling trailing off.
I don't know. I try to love GEER periodically and I wish I could better and more accurately ascertain why it has never moved me. SEH and TG are probably top 5 Clash songs for me. It's like they took all their best ideas at the time and put them in those two songs.
Re: God Tier GEER version
Good thought. It may have been more effective to have it go from the machine-gun drum parts into the staccato style of the B sections ("I'm gonna get a jacket just like yours..."). The song would be a lot more hoppin' that way. Then the B sections could maybe be in the more legato style of the current A sections, giving them more grandeur.Mark^Bastard wrote: ↑03 Jul 2022, 8:02amThe problem with Tommy Gun is the drum blasting leading into that drawn out "tommm-mmy gun". The lyrics/vocals (the arrangement, not the performance) let it down imo.Kory wrote: ↑01 Jul 2022, 6:34pmYeah it's pretty definitively a "difficult second album." Of course, that designation for a band like the Clash means it's still a world beater but you can definitely catch a whiff of aimlessness to it aside from the really constructed songs like SEH and SF. Tommy Gun to me has always seemed a little half-baked, even.matedog wrote: ↑01 Jul 2022, 5:26pmThat's definitely what I've said. I relistened last week and some interesting chord changes and rhythm changes caught my ear as a natural extension of some of the same from the first album, but more evolved I suppose. Some outros are more interesting than I give credit for (ATYP for example). I've bitched about some of the production choices (double tracking Joe on ECW), but also some arrangements are a bit misguided, like the sax on DST doesn't do much for me. The live version with Mick's leads are way better to my ears.Kory wrote: ↑01 Jul 2022, 2:41pmAs I recall, this is Matey's assessment as well. He dislikes all the songs ending with interminable outros, and (I think) also dislikes that there are too many guitar solos instead of distinct sections on many songs.Mark^Bastard wrote: ↑29 Jun 2022, 11:59pmI've come to the conclusion that the songs are all actually good. The problem is that they're needlessly long so there's only 10 of them,
I guess the constant guitar noodling throughout the album doesn't serve to elevate the songs as they should, for the most part. Like Guns on the Roof has this great break down/build up to this limp guitar solo. The outro vocals are kinda fun, but just kinda peters out with the noodling trailing off.
I don't know. I try to love GEER periodically and I wish I could better and more accurately ascertain why it has never moved me. SEH and TG are probably top 5 Clash songs for me. It's like they took all their best ideas at the time and put them in those two songs.
"Suck our Earth dick, Martians!" —Doc
Re: God Tier GEER version
I don't know. I like the sparse verses that build up so well. How the bass drum starts driving about halfway in before the kinda double time feel when the full drums finally kick in. Maybe I'm too drum focused, but I love the start/stop feel of the song. Everything is always building up and dropping out before building up again.Kory wrote: ↑05 Jul 2022, 3:01pmGood thought. It may have been more effective to have it go from the machine-gun drum parts into the staccato style of the B sections ("I'm gonna get a jacket just like yours..."). The song would be a lot more hoppin' that way. Then the B sections could maybe be in the more legato style of the current A sections, giving them more grandeur.Mark^Bastard wrote: ↑03 Jul 2022, 8:02amThe problem with Tommy Gun is the drum blasting leading into that drawn out "tommm-mmy gun". The lyrics/vocals (the arrangement, not the performance) let it down imo.Kory wrote: ↑01 Jul 2022, 6:34pmYeah it's pretty definitively a "difficult second album." Of course, that designation for a band like the Clash means it's still a world beater but you can definitely catch a whiff of aimlessness to it aside from the really constructed songs like SEH and SF. Tommy Gun to me has always seemed a little half-baked, even.matedog wrote: ↑01 Jul 2022, 5:26pmThat's definitely what I've said. I relistened last week and some interesting chord changes and rhythm changes caught my ear as a natural extension of some of the same from the first album, but more evolved I suppose. Some outros are more interesting than I give credit for (ATYP for example). I've bitched about some of the production choices (double tracking Joe on ECW), but also some arrangements are a bit misguided, like the sax on DST doesn't do much for me. The live version with Mick's leads are way better to my ears.
I guess the constant guitar noodling throughout the album doesn't serve to elevate the songs as they should, for the most part. Like Guns on the Roof has this great break down/build up to this limp guitar solo. The outro vocals are kinda fun, but just kinda peters out with the noodling trailing off.
I don't know. I try to love GEER periodically and I wish I could better and more accurately ascertain why it has never moved me. SEH and TG are probably top 5 Clash songs for me. It's like they took all their best ideas at the time and put them in those two songs.
Look, you have to establish context for these things. And I maintain that unless you appreciate the Fall of Constantinople, the Great Fire of London, and Mickey Mantle's fatalist alcoholism, live Freddy makes no sense. If you want to half-ass it, fine, go call Simon Schama to do the appendix.
- Marky Dread
- Messiah of the Milk Bar
- Posts: 59024
- Joined: 17 Jun 2008, 11:26am
Re: God Tier GEER version
My take on GEER is there is too much Mick going on.
On the first album Mick can be heard in the left and right channels with these brilliant little riffs complementing each other.
On GEER Mick can be heard in the left, right channels and also in the centre of the mix. All three areas playing different things. Plus I guess some of Joe's scratchy rhythm is in there It's simply over kill. It doesn't add to the albums power it creates a claustrophobic sound leaving little breathing space.
Add to this Pearlman originally mixing Joe lower in the mix then you get more guitar. And another thing Pearlman loved Topper's playing which is beyond doubt excellent but Topper is also mixed too loud in the mix on most tracks.
On the first album Mick can be heard in the left and right channels with these brilliant little riffs complementing each other.
On GEER Mick can be heard in the left, right channels and also in the centre of the mix. All three areas playing different things. Plus I guess some of Joe's scratchy rhythm is in there It's simply over kill. It doesn't add to the albums power it creates a claustrophobic sound leaving little breathing space.
Add to this Pearlman originally mixing Joe lower in the mix then you get more guitar. And another thing Pearlman loved Topper's playing which is beyond doubt excellent but Topper is also mixed too loud in the mix on most tracks.
Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty
We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.
"Without the common people you're nothing"
Nos Sumus Una Familia
Re: God Tier GEER version
The best thing about GEER is how present the bass is.Marky Dread wrote: ↑05 Jul 2022, 6:49pmMy take on GEER is there is too much Mick going on.
On the first album Mick can be heard in the left and right channels with these brilliant little riffs complementing each other.
On GEER Mick can be heard in the left, right channels and also in the centre of the mix. All three areas playing different things. Plus I guess some of Joe's scratchy rhythm is in there It's simply over kill. It doesn't add to the albums power it creates a claustrophobic sound leaving little breathing space.
Add to this Pearlman originally mixing Joe lower in the mix then you get more guitar. And another thing Pearlman loved Topper's playing which is beyond doubt excellent but Topper is also mixed too loud in the mix on most tracks.
"Suck our Earth dick, Martians!" —Doc
-
Mark^Bastard
- Sightsee MC
- Posts: 281
- Joined: 15 Jan 2009, 2:01am
Re: God Tier GEER version
Would it in theory be possible to mix the instruments differently with the software you use? Place them more specifically in the stereo spectrum and change their levels? It sounds far fetched with how thrown together everything is (like they were sharing the one mic haha).Marky Dread wrote: ↑05 Jul 2022, 6:49pmMy take on GEER is there is too much Mick going on.
On the first album Mick can be heard in the left and right channels with these brilliant little riffs complementing each other.
On GEER Mick can be heard in the left, right channels and also in the centre of the mix. All three areas playing different things. Plus I guess some of Joe's scratchy rhythm is in there It's simply over kill. It doesn't add to the albums power it creates a claustrophobic sound leaving little breathing space.
Add to this Pearlman originally mixing Joe lower in the mix then you get more guitar. And another thing Pearlman loved Topper's playing which is beyond doubt excellent but Topper is also mixed too loud in the mix on most tracks.
-
Mark^Bastard
- Sightsee MC
- Posts: 281
- Joined: 15 Jan 2009, 2:01am
Re: God Tier GEER version
Yeah at least for the start of the song. I don't know much musical theory or anything, but drawing out the words "tommy gun" over a bar(??) immediately after setting a machine gun pace with the drums just feels wrong.Kory wrote: ↑05 Jul 2022, 3:01pmGood thought. It may have been more effective to have it go from the machine-gun drum parts into the staccato style of the B sections ("I'm gonna get a jacket just like yours..."). The song would be a lot more hoppin' that way. Then the B sections could maybe be in the more legato style of the current A sections, giving them more grandeur.Mark^Bastard wrote: ↑03 Jul 2022, 8:02amThe problem with Tommy Gun is the drum blasting leading into that drawn out "tommm-mmy gun". The lyrics/vocals (the arrangement, not the performance) let it down imo.Kory wrote: ↑01 Jul 2022, 6:34pmYeah it's pretty definitively a "difficult second album." Of course, that designation for a band like the Clash means it's still a world beater but you can definitely catch a whiff of aimlessness to it aside from the really constructed songs like SEH and SF. Tommy Gun to me has always seemed a little half-baked, even.matedog wrote: ↑01 Jul 2022, 5:26pmThat's definitely what I've said. I relistened last week and some interesting chord changes and rhythm changes caught my ear as a natural extension of some of the same from the first album, but more evolved I suppose. Some outros are more interesting than I give credit for (ATYP for example). I've bitched about some of the production choices (double tracking Joe on ECW), but also some arrangements are a bit misguided, like the sax on DST doesn't do much for me. The live version with Mick's leads are way better to my ears.
I guess the constant guitar noodling throughout the album doesn't serve to elevate the songs as they should, for the most part. Like Guns on the Roof has this great break down/build up to this limp guitar solo. The outro vocals are kinda fun, but just kinda peters out with the noodling trailing off.
I don't know. I try to love GEER periodically and I wish I could better and more accurately ascertain why it has never moved me. SEH and TG are probably top 5 Clash songs for me. It's like they took all their best ideas at the time and put them in those two songs.