Please help dating some tracks from Clash on Broadway

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Maxym
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Please help dating some tracks from Clash on Broadway

Post by Maxym »

Hello,

I would like to know the (official) release years of the following tracks, I expect they were single b-sides or such :
- Janie Jones (demo)
- Careeer opportunity (demo)
- Red Angel Dragnet (edit)
- Ghetto defendant (edit)
- Rock the casbah (US single version)
- Should I Stay or should I go (US single version)
- Straight to Hell (unedited version)

And this one if mind-bugging...
- Cool confusion
Because... I had in mind that it first came on Super Black Mark Clash ( and this is what this Clash wiki start: https://clash.fandom.com/wiki/Cool_Confusion ) ... but it is the on Clash on Broadway's third CD, from 1991 ... but Super Black Mark Clash is from 1993 .
But at the same time, in my mind Clash on Broadway had 3 unreleased tracks which were One Emotion, Every Little Bit Hurts and Midnight to Stevens. Then, back then, was Cool Confusion a fourth unreleased track?
Used to be on Clash forums in early 2000s (different nickname), then they closed and/or I lost track (I don't remember exactly).

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Re: Please help dating some tracks from Clash on Broadway

Post by JohnS »

Maxym wrote:
13 Mar 2023, 9:47am
And this one if mind-bugging...
- Cool confusion
Because... I had in mind that it first came on Super Black Mark Clash ( and this is what this Clash wiki start: https://clash.fandom.com/wiki/Cool_Confusion ) ... but it is the on Clash on Broadway's third CD, from 1991 ... but Super Black Mark Clash is from 1993 .
But at the same time, in my mind Clash on Broadway had 3 unreleased tracks which were One Emotion, Every Little Bit Hurts and Midnight to Stevens. Then, back then, was Cool Confusion a fourth unreleased track?
Cool Confusion was originally released in 1983, B-side of US 'Should I Stay Or Should I Go'

https://www.discogs.com/master/552819-T ... hould-I-Go
Ignore Alien Hors d'oeuvres

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Re: Please help dating some tracks from Clash on Broadway

Post by matedog »

Maxym wrote:
13 Mar 2023, 9:47am
Hello,

I would like to know the (official) release years of the following tracks, I expect they were single b-sides or such :
- Janie Jones (demo) - Polydor demos from Nov. 76. Previously unreleased until the Clash on Broadway box.
- Careeer opportunity (demo) - Polydor demos from Nov. 76. Previously unreleased until the Clash on Broadway box.
- Red Angel Dragnet (edit) - I believe this is just an edit/shortened version of the album version. Previously unreleased until the Clash on Broadway box.
- Ghetto defendant (edit)I believe this is just an edit/shortened version of the album version. Previously unreleased until the Clash on Broadway box.
- Rock the casbah (US single version) As noted, it's the single version that has some minor edits/effects. It would have been released in 1982.
- Should I Stay or should I go (US single version) 82 release. Not sure what the difference is.
- Straight to Hell (unedited version) - Full "Rat Patrol" version. Previously unreleased until the Clash on Broadway box.

And this one if mind-bugging...
- Cool confusion
Because... I had in mind that it first came on Super Black Mark Clash ( and this is what this Clash wiki start: https://clash.fandom.com/wiki/Cool_Confusion ) ... but it is the on Clash on Broadway's third CD, from 1991 ... but Super Black Mark Clash is from 1993 .
But at the same time, in my mind Clash on Broadway had 3 unreleased tracks which were One Emotion, Every Little Bit Hurts and Midnight to Stevens. Then, back then, was Cool Confusion a fourth unreleased track?
Cool Confusion a bit...confusing. The SISOSIG b-side says it's 2:50 or so, but COB version is 3:15. Anyone know the difference?
Look, you have to establish context for these things. And I maintain that unless you appreciate the Fall of Constantinople, the Great Fire of London, and Mickey Mantle's fatalist alcoholism, live Freddy makes no sense. If you want to half-ass it, fine, go call Simon Schama to do the appendix.

matedog
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Re: Please help dating some tracks from Clash on Broadway

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Found this. It's a different mix/slightly different arrangement than the COB/SBMC version for sure. There's a lot more snare, the intro is slightly different. It's Cool Confusion, so I don't feel like listening all the way through and find out why it's 20 seconds shorter, but to answer your question, the COB is a version that was new as of Clash on Broadway and appears to have usurped the original b-side version as the "official" version.
Look, you have to establish context for these things. And I maintain that unless you appreciate the Fall of Constantinople, the Great Fire of London, and Mickey Mantle's fatalist alcoholism, live Freddy makes no sense. If you want to half-ass it, fine, go call Simon Schama to do the appendix.

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Re: Please help dating some tracks from Clash on Broadway

Post by APACHES67 »

matedog wrote:
13 Mar 2023, 2:19pm


Found this. It's a different mix/slightly different arrangement than the COB/SBMC version for sure. There's a lot more snare, the intro is slightly different. It's Cool Confusion, so I don't feel like listening all the way through and find out why it's 20 seconds shorter, but to answer your question, the COB is a version that was new as of Clash on Broadway and appears to have usurped the original b-side version as the "official" version.
Thanks Matedog. I knew Cool Confusion instrumental and Cool Confusion C.on B Version. This B-side Version is new For me. But it's an original or it's a home made remixed Version of a Clash fan?

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Re: Please help dating some tracks from Clash on Broadway

Post by Marky Dread »

matedog wrote:
13 Mar 2023, 2:19pm


Found this. It's a different mix/slightly different arrangement than the COB/SBMC version for sure. There's a lot more snare, the intro is slightly different. It's Cool Confusion, so I don't feel like listening all the way through and find out why it's 20 seconds shorter, but to answer your question, the COB is a version that was new as of Clash on Broadway and appears to have usurped the original b-side version as the "official" version.
That's the US B-side version that starts with Joe saying "Cool" it's a different mix and yes it's shorter.

This b-side version of "Cool Confusion" (with guitar) has yet to be released on CD. Only a stripped-down version without the guitar power chord track has been released on various box sets.
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Re: Please help dating some tracks from Clash on Broadway

Post by Maxym »

Marky Dread wrote:
13 Mar 2023, 7:16pm
Only a stripped-down version without the guitar power chord track has been released on various box sets.
Thanks for clarifications.

I just compared the versions I have for Cool Confusion :
  • Clash On Broadway - 1991 - 3:17
  • Super Black Market Clash - 1993 - 3:15 - Slightly louder than previous
  • Clash On Broadway (remastered) - 2000? - 3:16 - Very similar to previous
  • The Singles - 2006 - 3:14 - Very similar to previous
  • Sound System - 2013 - 3:12 - Loudest though not brickwalled, plays slightly faster (so that song ends 0.5 second earlier), slightly slower fade out.
Other differences in durations are silence before and after the song.
And indeed, none is the b-side version.
Used to be on Clash forums in early 2000s (different nickname), then they closed and/or I lost track (I don't remember exactly).

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Re: Please help dating some tracks from Clash on Broadway

Post by Marky Dread »

Maxym wrote:
13 Mar 2023, 11:51pm
Marky Dread wrote:
13 Mar 2023, 7:16pm
Only a stripped-down version without the guitar power chord track has been released on various box sets.
Thanks for clarifications.

I just compared the versions I have for Cool Confusion :
  • Clash On Broadway - 1991 - 3:17
  • Super Black Market Clash - 1993 - 3:15 - Slightly louder than previous
  • Clash On Broadway (remastered) - 2000? - 3:16 - Very similar to previous
  • The Singles - 2006 - 3:14 - Very similar to previous
  • Sound System - 2013 - 3:12 - Loudest though not brickwalled, plays slightly faster (so that song ends 0.5 second earlier), slightly slower fade out.
Other differences in durations are silence before and after the song.
And indeed, none is the b-side version.
Clash On Broadway originally released 1991 Vic Anesini mastering.

All the albums were remastered and re-released in 1999 with mastering by Bob Whitney and Ray Staff. With the COB box being released in 2000.

The earlier Vic Anesini mastering is far superior.

Though the best official released mastering is the Sound System box set by Tim Young.
Image

Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty


We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.

"Without the common people you're nothing"

Nos Sumus Una Familia

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Re: Please help dating some tracks from Clash on Broadway

Post by dave202 »

Marky Dread wrote:
14 Mar 2023, 2:37am
Maxym wrote:
13 Mar 2023, 11:51pm
Marky Dread wrote:
13 Mar 2023, 7:16pm
Only a stripped-down version without the guitar power chord track has been released on various box sets.
Thanks for clarifications.

I just compared the versions I have for Cool Confusion :
  • Clash On Broadway - 1991 - 3:17
  • Super Black Market Clash - 1993 - 3:15 - Slightly louder than previous
  • Clash On Broadway (remastered) - 2000? - 3:16 - Very similar to previous
  • The Singles - 2006 - 3:14 - Very similar to previous
  • Sound System - 2013 - 3:12 - Loudest though not brickwalled, plays slightly faster (so that song ends 0.5 second earlier), slightly slower fade out.
Other differences in durations are silence before and after the song.
And indeed, none is the b-side version.
Clash On Broadway originally released 1991 Vic Anesini mastering.

All the albums were remastered and re-released in 1999 with mastering by Bob Whitney and Ray Staff. With the COB box being released in 2000.

The earlier Vic Anesini mastering is far superior.

Though the best official released mastering is the Sound System box set by Tim Young.
I don't have your remasters to hand so can't check. Which version(s) have you worked on Marky?

Marky Dread
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Re: Please help dating some tracks from Clash on Broadway

Post by Marky Dread »

dave202 wrote:
14 Mar 2023, 7:37am
Marky Dread wrote:
14 Mar 2023, 2:37am
Maxym wrote:
13 Mar 2023, 11:51pm
Marky Dread wrote:
13 Mar 2023, 7:16pm
Only a stripped-down version without the guitar power chord track has been released on various box sets.
Thanks for clarifications.

I just compared the versions I have for Cool Confusion :
  • Clash On Broadway - 1991 - 3:17
  • Super Black Market Clash - 1993 - 3:15 - Slightly louder than previous
  • Clash On Broadway (remastered) - 2000? - 3:16 - Very similar to previous
  • The Singles - 2006 - 3:14 - Very similar to previous
  • Sound System - 2013 - 3:12 - Loudest though not brickwalled, plays slightly faster (so that song ends 0.5 second earlier), slightly slower fade out.
Other differences in durations are silence before and after the song.
And indeed, none is the b-side version.
Clash On Broadway originally released 1991 Vic Anesini mastering.

All the albums were remastered and re-released in 1999 with mastering by Bob Whitney and Ray Staff. With the COB box being released in 2000.

The earlier Vic Anesini mastering is far superior.

Though the best official released mastering is the Sound System box set by Tim Young.
I don't have your remasters to hand so can't check. Which version(s) have you worked on Marky?
I've redone them all over the years.
Image

Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty


We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.

"Without the common people you're nothing"

Nos Sumus Una Familia

matedog
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Re: Please help dating some tracks from Clash on Broadway

Post by matedog »

I figured Marky would swoop in with the definitive details.

Maybe it's the lack of familiarity, but I think I prefer the now erased from history b-side version. Some added distorted guitar and a snare backbeat peps it up a bit compared to the pretty sparse subsequent version(s).
Look, you have to establish context for these things. And I maintain that unless you appreciate the Fall of Constantinople, the Great Fire of London, and Mickey Mantle's fatalist alcoholism, live Freddy makes no sense. If you want to half-ass it, fine, go call Simon Schama to do the appendix.

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Re: Please help dating some tracks from Clash on Broadway

Post by Heston »

matedog wrote:
14 Mar 2023, 2:29pm
I figured Marky would swoop in with the definitive details.

Maybe it's the lack of familiarity, but I think I prefer the now erased from history b-side version. Some added distorted guitar and a snare backbeat peps it up a bit compared to the pretty sparse subsequent version(s).
Agreed but the best version is the Essential DVD version with the vocals added. I think it was BB who mixed a great version of it.
There's a tiny, tiny hopeful part of me that says you guys are running a Kaufmanesque long con on the board

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Re: Please help dating some tracks from Clash on Broadway

Post by TeddyB Not Logged In »

Heston wrote:
14 Mar 2023, 2:41pm
matedog wrote:
14 Mar 2023, 2:29pm
I figured Marky would swoop in with the definitive details.

Maybe it's the lack of familiarity, but I think I prefer the now erased from history b-side version. Some added distorted guitar and a snare backbeat peps it up a bit compared to the pretty sparse subsequent version(s).
Agreed but the best version is the Essential DVD version with the vocals added. I think it was BB who mixed a great version of it.
Yes. MIck would actually have attempted this with the multi-tracks but there’s no vocal on the Essential version and they haven’t resorted to A.I. I also agree with Marky’s assessment of the various official masterings (no surprise).

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Re: Please help dating some tracks from Clash on Broadway

Post by Stefano1972 »

About Cool Confusion, i like the remix from Heston
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Re: Please help dating some tracks from Clash on Broadway

Post by Heston »

Stefano1972 wrote:
15 Mar 2023, 8:33pm
About Cool Confusion, i like the remix from Heston
BB did a better job but I can't find a link at the moment.
There's a tiny, tiny hopeful part of me that says you guys are running a Kaufmanesque long con on the board

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