The Clash observations thread.

Clash clash clash. ¡VIVAN LOS NORTEAMERICANOS DEL IMCT Y LAS BRIGADAS DEL CADILLAC NUEVO!
Heston
User avatar
God of Thunder...and Rock 'n Roll
Posts: 34194
Joined: 15 Jun 2008, 4:07pm
Location: North of Watford Junction

Re: The Clash observations thread.

Post by Heston »

Inder wrote:
16 Aug 2020, 3:06pm
This very old list on Uncut had some cool info/details I hadn't read before:
SIMON MORAN: Joe used to play “Safe European Home” all the time in his solo sets, and the fact he did so many different interpretations only goes to show what a great song it was. The melody is ridiculously catchy and the lyrics are pure Clash. I know it’s one of Bruce Springsteen’s personal favourites, too, because he’d agreed to be a special guest when MTV were considering doing a special Storytellers programme on Joe. It’s a shame it never happened – I’m sure he would have had some interesting things to say about The Clash and he promised to perform “Safe European Home” and a couple of other songs with Joe.
(Somebody Got Murdered) STEVE ERICKSON: With all due respect to The Who and Led Zep, and notwithstanding my unreasoning adoration of Mott and The Jesus And Mary Chain, this song shows as much as any why, after The Beatles, Stones and Kinks, The Clash are the greatest British band. It was written for the William Friedkin movie Cruising but was never used. In any event, here they had the integrity to cast everything they were about to the winds of moral ambiguity, confronting the consequences of the violence implicit not only in their music but the movement they led. When the guns of Brixton get fired, someone gets dead, and not just for the duration of an album. “I’ve been very hungry/But not enough to kill,” is all the more moving for how it’s equal parts weariness and defiance, for how you can hear both the singer’s hunger and the determination to hold on to his humanity anyway.
JONES: But it was the pivotal track on that album. It’s like “London Calling” is at the top and it encompasses all the rest, like an umbrella, like the world in microcosm. With the backwards guitar solo I was thinking of trying to be like The Creation. I was into all that, like playing the guitar with a violin bow which I did on “I’m Not Down”.
DON LETTS: This was the first music video I ever directed. I’ll tell you a secret: it was all done by mistake. Because it was the first one I’d ever done, I was sort of making it up as I went along. We went down to the Thames to shoot the bloody thing but we didn’t know the Thames had a tide. You’re talking to a man who can’t swim here! So we got there and the river had gone down 10 feet. Then we had to fill things on the boat to get it up. Then it started to piss with rain, all by chance. But if those things hadn’t happened, it wouldn’t have been the video that it was. Like everything with punk rock, we made our problems our assets.
I knew about Cruising as apparently they commissioned a "heavy metal song". Maybe that's why it wasn't used! About the violin bow I was never sure if Mick was taking the piss. Cool info about Bruce, that would have been something else.
There's a tiny, tiny hopeful part of me that says you guys are running a Kaufmanesque long con on the board

Marky Dread
User avatar
Messiah of the Milk Bar
Posts: 47313
Joined: 17 Jun 2008, 11:26am

Re: The Clash observations thread.

Post by Marky Dread »

Heston wrote:
16 Aug 2020, 4:12pm
Inder wrote:
16 Aug 2020, 3:06pm
This very old list on Uncut had some cool info/details I hadn't read before:
SIMON MORAN: Joe used to play “Safe European Home” all the time in his solo sets, and the fact he did so many different interpretations only goes to show what a great song it was. The melody is ridiculously catchy and the lyrics are pure Clash. I know it’s one of Bruce Springsteen’s personal favourites, too, because he’d agreed to be a special guest when MTV were considering doing a special Storytellers programme on Joe. It’s a shame it never happened – I’m sure he would have had some interesting things to say about The Clash and he promised to perform “Safe European Home” and a couple of other songs with Joe.
(Somebody Got Murdered) STEVE ERICKSON: With all due respect to The Who and Led Zep, and notwithstanding my unreasoning adoration of Mott and The Jesus And Mary Chain, this song shows as much as any why, after The Beatles, Stones and Kinks, The Clash are the greatest British band. It was written for the William Friedkin movie Cruising but was never used. In any event, here they had the integrity to cast everything they were about to the winds of moral ambiguity, confronting the consequences of the violence implicit not only in their music but the movement they led. When the guns of Brixton get fired, someone gets dead, and not just for the duration of an album. “I’ve been very hungry/But not enough to kill,” is all the more moving for how it’s equal parts weariness and defiance, for how you can hear both the singer’s hunger and the determination to hold on to his humanity anyway.
JONES: But it was the pivotal track on that album. It’s like “London Calling” is at the top and it encompasses all the rest, like an umbrella, like the world in microcosm. With the backwards guitar solo I was thinking of trying to be like The Creation. I was into all that, like playing the guitar with a violin bow which I did on “I’m Not Down”.
DON LETTS: This was the first music video I ever directed. I’ll tell you a secret: it was all done by mistake. Because it was the first one I’d ever done, I was sort of making it up as I went along. We went down to the Thames to shoot the bloody thing but we didn’t know the Thames had a tide. You’re talking to a man who can’t swim here! So we got there and the river had gone down 10 feet. Then we had to fill things on the boat to get it up. Then it started to piss with rain, all by chance. But if those things hadn’t happened, it wouldn’t have been the video that it was. Like everything with punk rock, we made our problems our assets.
I knew about Cruising as apparently they commissioned a "heavy metal song". Maybe that's why it wasn't used! About the violin bow I was never sure if Mick was taking the piss. Cool info about Bruce, that would have been something else.
I think the violin bow thing is true. Mick is a big fan of Eddie Phillips and Jimmy Page.
Image

Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty

Heston
User avatar
God of Thunder...and Rock 'n Roll
Posts: 34194
Joined: 15 Jun 2008, 4:07pm
Location: North of Watford Junction

Re: The Clash observations thread.

Post by Heston »

Marky Dread wrote:
16 Aug 2020, 4:15pm
Heston wrote:
16 Aug 2020, 4:12pm
Inder wrote:
16 Aug 2020, 3:06pm
This very old list on Uncut had some cool info/details I hadn't read before:
SIMON MORAN: Joe used to play “Safe European Home” all the time in his solo sets, and the fact he did so many different interpretations only goes to show what a great song it was. The melody is ridiculously catchy and the lyrics are pure Clash. I know it’s one of Bruce Springsteen’s personal favourites, too, because he’d agreed to be a special guest when MTV were considering doing a special Storytellers programme on Joe. It’s a shame it never happened – I’m sure he would have had some interesting things to say about The Clash and he promised to perform “Safe European Home” and a couple of other songs with Joe.
(Somebody Got Murdered) STEVE ERICKSON: With all due respect to The Who and Led Zep, and notwithstanding my unreasoning adoration of Mott and The Jesus And Mary Chain, this song shows as much as any why, after The Beatles, Stones and Kinks, The Clash are the greatest British band. It was written for the William Friedkin movie Cruising but was never used. In any event, here they had the integrity to cast everything they were about to the winds of moral ambiguity, confronting the consequences of the violence implicit not only in their music but the movement they led. When the guns of Brixton get fired, someone gets dead, and not just for the duration of an album. “I’ve been very hungry/But not enough to kill,” is all the more moving for how it’s equal parts weariness and defiance, for how you can hear both the singer’s hunger and the determination to hold on to his humanity anyway.
JONES: But it was the pivotal track on that album. It’s like “London Calling” is at the top and it encompasses all the rest, like an umbrella, like the world in microcosm. With the backwards guitar solo I was thinking of trying to be like The Creation. I was into all that, like playing the guitar with a violin bow which I did on “I’m Not Down”.
DON LETTS: This was the first music video I ever directed. I’ll tell you a secret: it was all done by mistake. Because it was the first one I’d ever done, I was sort of making it up as I went along. We went down to the Thames to shoot the bloody thing but we didn’t know the Thames had a tide. You’re talking to a man who can’t swim here! So we got there and the river had gone down 10 feet. Then we had to fill things on the boat to get it up. Then it started to piss with rain, all by chance. But if those things hadn’t happened, it wouldn’t have been the video that it was. Like everything with punk rock, we made our problems our assets.
I knew about Cruising as apparently they commissioned a "heavy metal song". Maybe that's why it wasn't used! About the violin bow I was never sure if Mick was taking the piss. Cool info about Bruce, that would have been something else.
I think the violin bow thing is true. Mick is a big fan of Eddie Phillips and Jimmy Page.
Yeah, it's possible. Hard to detect it on the record to my ears but I'm not even sure where it is.
There's a tiny, tiny hopeful part of me that says you guys are running a Kaufmanesque long con on the board

Marky Dread
User avatar
Messiah of the Milk Bar
Posts: 47313
Joined: 17 Jun 2008, 11:26am

Re: The Clash observations thread.

Post by Marky Dread »

Heston wrote:
16 Aug 2020, 4:40pm
Marky Dread wrote:
16 Aug 2020, 4:15pm
Heston wrote:
16 Aug 2020, 4:12pm
Inder wrote:
16 Aug 2020, 3:06pm
This very old list on Uncut had some cool info/details I hadn't read before:
SIMON MORAN: Joe used to play “Safe European Home” all the time in his solo sets, and the fact he did so many different interpretations only goes to show what a great song it was. The melody is ridiculously catchy and the lyrics are pure Clash. I know it’s one of Bruce Springsteen’s personal favourites, too, because he’d agreed to be a special guest when MTV were considering doing a special Storytellers programme on Joe. It’s a shame it never happened – I’m sure he would have had some interesting things to say about The Clash and he promised to perform “Safe European Home” and a couple of other songs with Joe.
(Somebody Got Murdered) STEVE ERICKSON: With all due respect to The Who and Led Zep, and notwithstanding my unreasoning adoration of Mott and The Jesus And Mary Chain, this song shows as much as any why, after The Beatles, Stones and Kinks, The Clash are the greatest British band. It was written for the William Friedkin movie Cruising but was never used. In any event, here they had the integrity to cast everything they were about to the winds of moral ambiguity, confronting the consequences of the violence implicit not only in their music but the movement they led. When the guns of Brixton get fired, someone gets dead, and not just for the duration of an album. “I’ve been very hungry/But not enough to kill,” is all the more moving for how it’s equal parts weariness and defiance, for how you can hear both the singer’s hunger and the determination to hold on to his humanity anyway.
JONES: But it was the pivotal track on that album. It’s like “London Calling” is at the top and it encompasses all the rest, like an umbrella, like the world in microcosm. With the backwards guitar solo I was thinking of trying to be like The Creation. I was into all that, like playing the guitar with a violin bow which I did on “I’m Not Down”.
DON LETTS: This was the first music video I ever directed. I’ll tell you a secret: it was all done by mistake. Because it was the first one I’d ever done, I was sort of making it up as I went along. We went down to the Thames to shoot the bloody thing but we didn’t know the Thames had a tide. You’re talking to a man who can’t swim here! So we got there and the river had gone down 10 feet. Then we had to fill things on the boat to get it up. Then it started to piss with rain, all by chance. But if those things hadn’t happened, it wouldn’t have been the video that it was. Like everything with punk rock, we made our problems our assets.
I knew about Cruising as apparently they commissioned a "heavy metal song". Maybe that's why it wasn't used! About the violin bow I was never sure if Mick was taking the piss. Cool info about Bruce, that would have been something else.
I think the violin bow thing is true. Mick is a big fan of Eddie Phillips and Jimmy Page.
Yeah, it's possible. Hard to detect it on the record to my ears but I'm not even sure where it is.
The main guitar riff being played all the way through.
Image

Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty

Heston
User avatar
God of Thunder...and Rock 'n Roll
Posts: 34194
Joined: 15 Jun 2008, 4:07pm
Location: North of Watford Junction

Re: The Clash observations thread.

Post by Heston »

Marky Dread wrote:
16 Aug 2020, 5:06pm
Heston wrote:
16 Aug 2020, 4:40pm
Marky Dread wrote:
16 Aug 2020, 4:15pm
Heston wrote:
16 Aug 2020, 4:12pm
I knew about Cruising as apparently they commissioned a "heavy metal song". Maybe that's why it wasn't used! About the violin bow I was never sure if Mick was taking the piss. Cool info about Bruce, that would have been something else.
I think the violin bow thing is true. Mick is a big fan of Eddie Phillips and Jimmy Page.
Yeah, it's possible. Hard to detect it on the record to my ears but I'm not even sure where it is.
The main guitar riff being played all the way through.
I'll have to take another listen.
There's a tiny, tiny hopeful part of me that says you guys are running a Kaufmanesque long con on the board

gkbill
Graffiti Bandit Pioneer
Posts: 2142
Joined: 23 Jun 2008, 9:21pm

Re: The Clash observations thread.

Post by gkbill »

Hello,

I'll take any opportunity to sneak in a Spinal Tap reference:


Low Down Low
Graffiti Bandit Pioneer
Posts: 2407
Joined: 21 Aug 2014, 9:08am

Re: The Clash observations thread.

Post by Low Down Low »

Heston wrote:
16 Aug 2020, 5:22pm
Marky Dread wrote:
16 Aug 2020, 5:06pm
Heston wrote:
16 Aug 2020, 4:40pm
Marky Dread wrote:
16 Aug 2020, 4:15pm
Heston wrote:
16 Aug 2020, 4:12pm


I knew about Cruising as apparently they commissioned a "heavy metal song". Maybe that's why it wasn't used! About the violin bow I was never sure if Mick was taking the piss. Cool info about Bruce, that would have been something else.
I think the violin bow thing is true. Mick is a big fan of Eddie Phillips and Jimmy Page.
Yeah, it's possible. Hard to detect it on the record to my ears but I'm not even sure where it is.
The main guitar riff being played all the way through.
I'll have to take another listen.
Sounds to me like it could be the bits that link verses and chorus, initially from 14 seconds. Might be clearer on stems perhaps.

River
Junco Partner
Posts: 479
Joined: 19 May 2011, 4:23pm

Re: The Clash observations thread.

Post by River »

The Boston show during the Take the Fifth tour is great. Especially Jimmy Jazz at the end, Mick's guitar sounds really nice with a little layer of reverb on it (as well as the phase effect), and Mickey's organ blends really nicely with it. Especially on the beginning and end of the song.

KCportland
User avatar
Dirty Punk
Posts: 64
Joined: 23 May 2015, 12:49am
Location: Seattle

Re: The Clash observations thread.

Post by KCportland »

If Devo made Cut the Crap in 85, it would have been hailed a miraculous return to form.

I love CTC as is. Garish, Guady, pop-art/Mad Max version of "punk". Only thing I'd change is axe North and South for Do it Now (which is how I have it sequenced on my version)

edit: here's Devo's 1985 single "Here To Go" for a contrast: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b6RwHjlqsx4

Inder
User avatar
corecore vanguard
Posts: 9685
Joined: 14 Jun 2008, 3:28pm

Re: The Clash observations thread.

Post by Inder »

Hadn't seen this video before — neat!


Inder
User avatar
corecore vanguard
Posts: 9685
Joined: 14 Jun 2008, 3:28pm

Re: The Clash observations thread.

Post by Inder »

KCportland wrote:
21 Aug 2020, 5:07pm
If Devo made Cut the Crap in 85, it would have been hailed a miraculous return to form.

I love CTC as is. Garish, Guady, pop-art/Mad Max version of "punk". Only thing I'd change is axe North and South for Do it Now (which is how I have it sequenced on my version)

edit: here's Devo's 1985 single "Here To Go" for a contrast: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b6RwHjlqsx4
I went off to camp around 1998/99 on a remote island in BC with a discman and a single CD. I must have listened to CTC approximately one billion times over those six weeks.

Marky Dread
User avatar
Messiah of the Milk Bar
Posts: 47313
Joined: 17 Jun 2008, 11:26am

Re: The Clash observations thread.

Post by Marky Dread »

Inder wrote:
24 Aug 2020, 8:44pm
Hadn't seen this video before — neat!

I like the Neurotic Outsiders version.
Image

Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty

Marky Dread
User avatar
Messiah of the Milk Bar
Posts: 47313
Joined: 17 Jun 2008, 11:26am

Re: The Clash observations thread.

Post by Marky Dread »

KCportland wrote:
21 Aug 2020, 5:07pm
If Devo made Cut the Crap in 85, it would have been hailed a miraculous return to form.

I love CTC as is. Garish, Guady, pop-art/Mad Max version of "punk". Only thing I'd change is axe North and South for Do it Now (which is how I have it sequenced on my version)

edit: here's Devo's 1985 single "Here To Go" for a contrast: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b6RwHjlqsx4
Maybe CtC sounds a bit like Devo with the synths but we really wanted it to sound like The Clash.
Image

Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty

KCportland
User avatar
Dirty Punk
Posts: 64
Joined: 23 May 2015, 12:49am
Location: Seattle

Re: The Clash observations thread.

Post by KCportland »

Marky Dread wrote:
26 Aug 2020, 5:47pm
KCportland wrote:
21 Aug 2020, 5:07pm
If Devo made Cut the Crap in 85, it would have been hailed a miraculous return to form.

I love CTC as is. Garish, Guady, pop-art/Mad Max version of "punk". Only thing I'd change is axe North and South for Do it Now (which is how I have it sequenced on my version)

edit: here's Devo's 1985 single "Here To Go" for a contrast: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b6RwHjlqsx4
Maybe CtC sounds a bit like Devo with the synths but we really wanted it to sound like The Clash.
Totally. But what I guess I'm getting at is that is that there seems to be a rigidity about what the Clash is or isn't among fans, critics and members of the actual band that other bands and their fans don't have. There is a perception of this band as a sort of family unit in that members can't be legitimately replaced with others because they simply aren't blood related and thus never can be. This sort of thinking has been perpetuated most by the band themselves and their respective inner circles over the last 20 or so years, ever since the Clash were "declared" to be a member of the elite bands of all time. They've rewritten history with every official documentary or retrospective to the point where so much of it can be proven demonstrably false (depending on what day of the week it is, Paul and Mick will tell you they met Joe in a dole queue or at a 101ers gig or somewhere else entirely, and depending on temperature and humidity percentage, Keith Levene either does or does not exist).

But the fact that they cannot and will not acknowledge the existence of a sixth album is ultimately the most egregious. It's borderline insulting to long-time fan's intelligence. The Velvet Underground had a Nico era, a John Cale era and a Doug Yule era. These are acknowledged as canonical by fans, critics and band. Why can't the Clash do the same? What is oh-so-sacred?

Cut The Crap is an album released by the Clash in 1985, with all music and lyrics authored by frontman Joe Strummer. He and Bernie Rhodes, who lest we forget was affiliated with the Clash before Joe, along with Nick Sheppard and occasionally Vince and Pete, arranged the album together in London and Munich in the first half of 85. Ego's clashed, Bernie turned dictatorial, other's contributions were sidelined and no one walked away from the project satisfied. That sounds like a much more typical album making experience than we'd all like to believe.

I love the album ultimately because it's a Clash album with some good songs and great vocal performances by Joe. It is equally boneheaded and thrilling in varying ways, and there is legitimately nothing else like it out there.

Heston
User avatar
God of Thunder...and Rock 'n Roll
Posts: 34194
Joined: 15 Jun 2008, 4:07pm
Location: North of Watford Junction

Re: The Clash observations thread.

Post by Heston »

KCportland wrote:
26 Aug 2020, 7:57pm
Marky Dread wrote:
26 Aug 2020, 5:47pm
KCportland wrote:
21 Aug 2020, 5:07pm
If Devo made Cut the Crap in 85, it would have been hailed a miraculous return to form.

I love CTC as is. Garish, Guady, pop-art/Mad Max version of "punk". Only thing I'd change is axe North and South for Do it Now (which is how I have it sequenced on my version)

edit: here's Devo's 1985 single "Here To Go" for a contrast: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b6RwHjlqsx4
Maybe CtC sounds a bit like Devo with the synths but we really wanted it to sound like The Clash.
Totally. But what I guess I'm getting at is that is that there seems to be a rigidity about what the Clash is or isn't among fans, critics and members of the actual band that other bands and their fans don't have. There is a perception of this band as a sort of family unit in that members can't be legitimately replaced with others because they simply aren't blood related and thus never can be. This sort of thinking has been perpetuated most by the band themselves and their respective inner circles over the last 20 or so years, ever since the Clash were "declared" to be a member of the elite bands of all time. They've rewritten history with every official documentary or retrospective to the point where so much of it can be proven demonstrably false (depending on what day of the week it is, Paul and Mick will tell you they met Joe in a dole queue or at a 101ers gig or somewhere else entirely, and depending on temperature and humidity percentage, Keith Levene either does or does not exist).

But the fact that they cannot and will not acknowledge the existence of a sixth album is ultimately the most egregious. It's borderline insulting to long-time fan's intelligence. The Velvet Underground had a Nico era, a John Cale era and a Doug Yule era. These are acknowledged as canonical by fans, critics and band. Why can't the Clash do the same? What is oh-so-sacred?

Cut The Crap is an album released by the Clash in 1985, with all music and lyrics authored by frontman Joe Strummer. He and Bernie Rhodes, who lest we forget was affiliated with the Clash before Joe, along with Nick Sheppard and occasionally Vince and Pete, arranged the album together in London and Munich in the first half of 85. Ego's clashed, Bernie turned dictatorial, other's contributions were sidelined and no one walked away from the project satisfied. That sounds like a much more typical album making experience than we'd all like to believe.

I love the album ultimately because it's a Clash album with some good songs and great vocal performances by Joe. It is equally boneheaded and thrilling in varying ways, and there is legitimately nothing else like it out there.
I'm signing this off. Great post.
There's a tiny, tiny hopeful part of me that says you guys are running a Kaufmanesque long con on the board

Post Reply