Brexit what Brexit!

Politics and other such topical creams.
Marky Dread
User avatar
Messiah of the Milk Bar
Posts: 58881
Joined: 17 Jun 2008, 11:26am

Re: Brexit what Brexit!

Post by Marky Dread »

Dr. Medulla wrote:
14 Nov 2018, 5:21pm
Marky Dread wrote:
14 Nov 2018, 5:15pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
14 Nov 2018, 5:07pm
Hold another referendum, ranked ballot, with the various proposals including status quo, then bind lawmakers to the result.
See this is my problem. Democracy and the people have spoken even though I believe it to be a huge mistake. Vote again and you'll be voting and re-voting on every bloody subject from here to eternity.

It sets a bad precedent even though the country will suffer. All those people that came out at the weekend to show their respects for the armistice who believe their loved ones fought for democracy and a better world and now we get to this shit.
But if the lawmakers are stuck at finding a strategy supported by a majority, it makes sense to consult the electorate directly and with more specificity for what they should do. And if the public, having considered the issue further, now think it's a bad idea altogether, that seems smarter than forcing them to go along with the mood of a few years ago. That Parliament can't get it done is what makes a second, more specific and binding vote a viable way out.
You seem to have a lot more faith in the general public and lawmakers than I do. This Is England and if it can be fucked up then so shall it be.
Image

Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty


We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.

"Without the common people you're nothing"

Nos Sumus Una Familia

Dr. Medulla
User avatar
Atheistic Epileptic
Posts: 115977
Joined: 15 Jun 2008, 2:00pm
Location: Straight Banana, Idaho

Re: Brexit what Brexit!

Post by Dr. Medulla »

Marky Dread wrote:
14 Nov 2018, 5:27pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
14 Nov 2018, 5:21pm
Marky Dread wrote:
14 Nov 2018, 5:15pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
14 Nov 2018, 5:07pm
Hold another referendum, ranked ballot, with the various proposals including status quo, then bind lawmakers to the result.
See this is my problem. Democracy and the people have spoken even though I believe it to be a huge mistake. Vote again and you'll be voting and re-voting on every bloody subject from here to eternity.

It sets a bad precedent even though the country will suffer. All those people that came out at the weekend to show their respects for the armistice who believe their loved ones fought for democracy and a better world and now we get to this shit.
But if the lawmakers are stuck at finding a strategy supported by a majority, it makes sense to consult the electorate directly and with more specificity for what they should do. And if the public, having considered the issue further, now think it's a bad idea altogether, that seems smarter than forcing them to go along with the mood of a few years ago. That Parliament can't get it done is what makes a second, more specific and binding vote a viable way out.
You seem to have a lot more faith in the general public and lawmakers than I do. This Is England and if it can be fucked up then so shall it be.
Lawmakers, no; people, yes. Regardless, I'm mainly talking about a means out of an impasse.
"I never doubted myself for a minute for I knew that my monkey-strong bowels were girded with strength, like the loins of a dragon ribboned with fat and the opulence of buffalo dung." - Richard Nixon, Checkers Speech, abandoned early draft

Marky Dread
User avatar
Messiah of the Milk Bar
Posts: 58881
Joined: 17 Jun 2008, 11:26am

Re: Brexit what Brexit!

Post by Marky Dread »

Dr. Medulla wrote:
14 Nov 2018, 5:57pm
Marky Dread wrote:
14 Nov 2018, 5:27pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
14 Nov 2018, 5:21pm
Marky Dread wrote:
14 Nov 2018, 5:15pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
14 Nov 2018, 5:07pm
Hold another referendum, ranked ballot, with the various proposals including status quo, then bind lawmakers to the result.
See this is my problem. Democracy and the people have spoken even though I believe it to be a huge mistake. Vote again and you'll be voting and re-voting on every bloody subject from here to eternity.

It sets a bad precedent even though the country will suffer. All those people that came out at the weekend to show their respects for the armistice who believe their loved ones fought for democracy and a better world and now we get to this shit.
But if the lawmakers are stuck at finding a strategy supported by a majority, it makes sense to consult the electorate directly and with more specificity for what they should do. And if the public, having considered the issue further, now think it's a bad idea altogether, that seems smarter than forcing them to go along with the mood of a few years ago. That Parliament can't get it done is what makes a second, more specific and binding vote a viable way out.
You seem to have a lot more faith in the general public and lawmakers than I do. This Is England and if it can be fucked up then so shall it be.
Lawmakers, no; people, yes. Regardless, I'm mainly talking about a means out of an impasse.
The solution to this gordian knot of British politics seems a simple one. However I think a referendum will only strengthen the Brexiteers resolve. There is a whole band of an older generation that will not be shifted in their stance and they hold a lot of power. The young and the sensible might take to the streets in what appears to be huge numbers but their number is small compared to these armchair voters.
Image

Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty


We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.

"Without the common people you're nothing"

Nos Sumus Una Familia

Dr. Medulla
User avatar
Atheistic Epileptic
Posts: 115977
Joined: 15 Jun 2008, 2:00pm
Location: Straight Banana, Idaho

Re: Brexit what Brexit!

Post by Dr. Medulla »

Marky Dread wrote:
14 Nov 2018, 6:11pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
14 Nov 2018, 5:57pm
Marky Dread wrote:
14 Nov 2018, 5:27pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
14 Nov 2018, 5:21pm
Marky Dread wrote:
14 Nov 2018, 5:15pm


See this is my problem. Democracy and the people have spoken even though I believe it to be a huge mistake. Vote again and you'll be voting and re-voting on every bloody subject from here to eternity.

It sets a bad precedent even though the country will suffer. All those people that came out at the weekend to show their respects for the armistice who believe their loved ones fought for democracy and a better world and now we get to this shit.
But if the lawmakers are stuck at finding a strategy supported by a majority, it makes sense to consult the electorate directly and with more specificity for what they should do. And if the public, having considered the issue further, now think it's a bad idea altogether, that seems smarter than forcing them to go along with the mood of a few years ago. That Parliament can't get it done is what makes a second, more specific and binding vote a viable way out.
You seem to have a lot more faith in the general public and lawmakers than I do. This Is England and if it can be fucked up then so shall it be.
Lawmakers, no; people, yes. Regardless, I'm mainly talking about a means out of an impasse.
The solution to this gordian knot of British politics seems a simple one. However I think a referendum will only strengthen the Brexiteers resolve. There is a whole band of an older generation that will not be shifted in their stance and they hold a lot of power. The young and the sensible might take to the streets in what appears to be huge numbers but their number is small compared to these armchair voters.
If the No side can't win on a second try, so be it. The point is to achieve some kind of stamp of legitimacy on an actual plan, whether it's hard leave, soft leave, stay, or some other option.
"I never doubted myself for a minute for I knew that my monkey-strong bowels were girded with strength, like the loins of a dragon ribboned with fat and the opulence of buffalo dung." - Richard Nixon, Checkers Speech, abandoned early draft

Marky Dread
User avatar
Messiah of the Milk Bar
Posts: 58881
Joined: 17 Jun 2008, 11:26am

Re: Brexit what Brexit!

Post by Marky Dread »

Dr. Medulla wrote:
14 Nov 2018, 6:20pm
Marky Dread wrote:
14 Nov 2018, 6:11pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
14 Nov 2018, 5:57pm
Marky Dread wrote:
14 Nov 2018, 5:27pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
14 Nov 2018, 5:21pm


But if the lawmakers are stuck at finding a strategy supported by a majority, it makes sense to consult the electorate directly and with more specificity for what they should do. And if the public, having considered the issue further, now think it's a bad idea altogether, that seems smarter than forcing them to go along with the mood of a few years ago. That Parliament can't get it done is what makes a second, more specific and binding vote a viable way out.
You seem to have a lot more faith in the general public and lawmakers than I do. This Is England and if it can be fucked up then so shall it be.
Lawmakers, no; people, yes. Regardless, I'm mainly talking about a means out of an impasse.
The solution to this gordian knot of British politics seems a simple one. However I think a referendum will only strengthen the Brexiteers resolve. There is a whole band of an older generation that will not be shifted in their stance and they hold a lot of power. The young and the sensible might take to the streets in what appears to be huge numbers but their number is small compared to these armchair voters.
If the No side can't win on a second try, so be it. The point is to achieve some kind of stamp of legitimacy on an actual plan, whether it's hard leave, soft leave, stay, or some other option.
I don't believe in a second try. I also feel it will be an even bigger shock than first time around. The people won in a majority first time out and the government who created this bloody mess needs to sort it out and respect that majority. Is WWIII an option?
Image

Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty


We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.

"Without the common people you're nothing"

Nos Sumus Una Familia

dave202
Graffiti Bandit Pioneer
Posts: 1964
Joined: 07 Jul 2008, 7:56am
Location: Dundee Scotland

Re: Brexit what Brexit!

Post by dave202 »

Marky Dread wrote:
14 Nov 2018, 6:26pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
14 Nov 2018, 6:20pm
Marky Dread wrote:
14 Nov 2018, 6:11pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
14 Nov 2018, 5:57pm
Marky Dread wrote:
14 Nov 2018, 5:27pm


You seem to have a lot more faith in the general public and lawmakers than I do. This Is England and if it can be fucked up then so shall it be.
Lawmakers, no; people, yes. Regardless, I'm mainly talking about a means out of an impasse.
The solution to this gordian knot of British politics seems a simple one. However I think a referendum will only strengthen the Brexiteers resolve. There is a whole band of an older generation that will not be shifted in their stance and they hold a lot of power. The young and the sensible might take to the streets in what appears to be huge numbers but their number is small compared to these armchair voters.
If the No side can't win on a second try, so be it. The point is to achieve some kind of stamp of legitimacy on an actual plan, whether it's hard leave, soft leave, stay, or some other option.
I don't believe in a second try. I also feel it will be an even bigger shock than first time around. The people won in a majority first time out and the government who created this bloody mess needs to sort it out and respect that majority. Is WWIII an option?
There wasn't a majority here in Scotland, we voted to stay in bigger numbers than the 'Yes' vote won on a national basis (% wise). We were also lied to a couple of years earlier when we were told the only way for Scotland to stay in the EU was to vote 'No' in our referendum for our own country. This episode has swayed a lot of the deluded Scots who will not fall for that again.

101Walterton
User avatar
The Best
Posts: 21973
Joined: 15 Jun 2008, 5:36pm
Location: Volcanic Rock In The Pacific

Re: Brexit what Brexit!

Post by 101Walterton »

Brexit would be a lot less painful if every time they say Ireland on the news they don’t say it in a ridiculous OTT Irish accent!!!
What is with that? No one says Wales in a Welsh accent (apart from the Welsh) or Scotland, America, Australia so why Ireland.
Or is this just a NZ thing?

Marky Dread
User avatar
Messiah of the Milk Bar
Posts: 58881
Joined: 17 Jun 2008, 11:26am

Re: Brexit what Brexit!

Post by Marky Dread »

dave202 wrote:
15 Nov 2018, 2:18pm
Marky Dread wrote:
14 Nov 2018, 6:26pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
14 Nov 2018, 6:20pm
Marky Dread wrote:
14 Nov 2018, 6:11pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
14 Nov 2018, 5:57pm


Lawmakers, no; people, yes. Regardless, I'm mainly talking about a means out of an impasse.
The solution to this gordian knot of British politics seems a simple one. However I think a referendum will only strengthen the Brexiteers resolve. There is a whole band of an older generation that will not be shifted in their stance and they hold a lot of power. The young and the sensible might take to the streets in what appears to be huge numbers but their number is small compared to these armchair voters.
If the No side can't win on a second try, so be it. The point is to achieve some kind of stamp of legitimacy on an actual plan, whether it's hard leave, soft leave, stay, or some other option.
I don't believe in a second try. I also feel it will be an even bigger shock than first time around. The people won in a majority first time out and the government who created this bloody mess needs to sort it out and respect that majority. Is WWIII an option?
There wasn't a majority here in Scotland, we voted to stay in bigger numbers than the 'Yes' vote won on a national basis (% wise). We were also lied to a couple of years earlier when we were told the only way for Scotland to stay in the EU was to vote 'No' in our referendum for our own country. This episode has swayed a lot of the deluded Scots who will not fall for that again.
Yep I hear you mate. I purposely only mentioned England further up the thread. Scotland should be recognised as it's own country with devolution and become the automous body it craves to be. I would happily become a Scot regards to Brexit.
Image

Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty


We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.

"Without the common people you're nothing"

Nos Sumus Una Familia

Marky Dread
User avatar
Messiah of the Milk Bar
Posts: 58881
Joined: 17 Jun 2008, 11:26am

Re: Brexit what Brexit!

Post by Marky Dread »

101Walterton wrote:
15 Nov 2018, 2:52pm
Brexit would be a lot less painful if every time they say Ireland on the news they don’t say it in a ridiculous OTT Irish accent!!!
What is with that? No one says Wales in a Welsh accent (apart from the Welsh) or Scotland, America, Australia so why Ireland.
Or is this just a NZ thing?
I've not noticed it on the news here must be NZ thing.
Image

Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty


We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.

"Without the common people you're nothing"

Nos Sumus Una Familia

101Walterton
User avatar
The Best
Posts: 21973
Joined: 15 Jun 2008, 5:36pm
Location: Volcanic Rock In The Pacific

Re: Brexit what Brexit!

Post by 101Walterton »

Marky Dread wrote:
15 Nov 2018, 3:13pm
101Walterton wrote:
15 Nov 2018, 2:52pm
Brexit would be a lot less painful if every time they say Ireland on the news they don’t say it in a ridiculous OTT Irish accent!!!
What is with that? No one says Wales in a Welsh accent (apart from the Welsh) or Scotland, America, Australia so why Ireland.
Or is this just a NZ thing?
I've not noticed it on the news here must be NZ thing.
All the plastic Paddies do it now as well. They kiss the Blarney Stone and get pissed on Guinness in Dublin and all of a sudden they can’t pronounce Ireland. It really annoys me. Get off my lawn!!!

dave202
Graffiti Bandit Pioneer
Posts: 1964
Joined: 07 Jul 2008, 7:56am
Location: Dundee Scotland

Re: Brexit what Brexit!

Post by dave202 »

Marky Dread wrote:
15 Nov 2018, 3:12pm
dave202 wrote:
15 Nov 2018, 2:18pm
Marky Dread wrote:
14 Nov 2018, 6:26pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
14 Nov 2018, 6:20pm
Marky Dread wrote:
14 Nov 2018, 6:11pm


The solution to this gordian knot of British politics seems a simple one. However I think a referendum will only strengthen the Brexiteers resolve. There is a whole band of an older generation that will not be shifted in their stance and they hold a lot of power. The young and the sensible might take to the streets in what appears to be huge numbers but their number is small compared to these armchair voters.
If the No side can't win on a second try, so be it. The point is to achieve some kind of stamp of legitimacy on an actual plan, whether it's hard leave, soft leave, stay, or some other option.
I don't believe in a second try. I also feel it will be an even bigger shock than first time around. The people won in a majority first time out and the government who created this bloody mess needs to sort it out and respect that majority. Is WWIII an option?
There wasn't a majority here in Scotland, we voted to stay in bigger numbers than the 'Yes' vote won on a national basis (% wise). We were also lied to a couple of years earlier when we were told the only way for Scotland to stay in the EU was to vote 'No' in our referendum for our own country. This episode has swayed a lot of the deluded Scots who will not fall for that again.
Yep I hear you mate. I purposely only mentioned England further up the thread. Scotland should be recognised as it's own country with devolution and become the automous body it craves to be. I would happily become a Scot regards to Brexit.
Good to hear. I'm not a 'Nationalist at all costs', but I just think we are a nation and able to self-govern, and the (slight) difference is better served by looking after ourselves.

101Walterton
User avatar
The Best
Posts: 21973
Joined: 15 Jun 2008, 5:36pm
Location: Volcanic Rock In The Pacific

Re: Brexit what Brexit!

Post by 101Walterton »

Isn’t it time for Ireland to be reunited?
If the unifying cause of Brexit doesn’t do it nothing will.

Silent Majority
Singer-Songwriter Nancy
Posts: 18702
Joined: 10 Nov 2008, 8:28pm
Location: South Londoner in the Midlands.

Re: Brexit what Brexit!

Post by Silent Majority »

101Walterton wrote:
16 Nov 2018, 4:53pm
Isn’t it time for Ireland to be reunited?
If the unifying cause of Brexit doesn’t do it nothing will.
Not with the DUP the only thing keeping the Tories in power.
a lifetime serving one machine
Is ten times worse than prison


www.pexlives.libsyn.com/

Marky Dread
User avatar
Messiah of the Milk Bar
Posts: 58881
Joined: 17 Jun 2008, 11:26am

Re: Brexit what Brexit!

Post by Marky Dread »

Silent Majority wrote:
16 Nov 2018, 5:48pm
101Walterton wrote:
16 Nov 2018, 4:53pm
Isn’t it time for Ireland to be reunited?
If the unifying cause of Brexit doesn’t do it nothing will.
Not with the DUP the only thing keeping the Tories in power.
This.
Image

Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty


We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.

"Without the common people you're nothing"

Nos Sumus Una Familia

101Walterton
User avatar
The Best
Posts: 21973
Joined: 15 Jun 2008, 5:36pm
Location: Volcanic Rock In The Pacific

Re: Brexit what Brexit!

Post by 101Walterton »

Marky Dread wrote:
16 Nov 2018, 7:19pm
Silent Majority wrote:
16 Nov 2018, 5:48pm
101Walterton wrote:
16 Nov 2018, 4:53pm
Isn’t it time for Ireland to be reunited?
If the unifying cause of Brexit doesn’t do it nothing will.
Not with the DUP the only thing keeping the Tories in power.
This.
Aren’t the DUP against Brexit?
I know politicians don’t want unified Ireland but the Irish on both sides dont want a border between them. That is a good start.

Post Reply