Music opinion/question of the week...

General music discussion.
WestwayKid
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Re: Music opinion/question of the week...

Post by WestwayKid » 14 Feb 2019, 9:33am

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/13/arts ... n-sex.html

Deeply disturbing. I am a big Ryan Adams fan. His music has helped me get through some really bad times. I'm not shocked (sadly). He has a reputation for being narcissistic and obnoxious and so on - but he's gotten a pass (largely) because he was so talented. The article also mentions how music has largely avoided the #MeToo movement because that sort of behavior has long been accepted as part of the deal. I would guarantee that Gene Simmons has done worse than Ryan Adams and that's not to defend Adams at all - just a point made to highlight how ingrained it is within rock history. Personally, I find this type of behavior to be disgusting - using a position of power to hurt people - whether it's Ryan Adams "sexting" with a 14-year-old girl or Jimmy Page and a bunch of teenage groupies back in the 1970's and I'm hopeful that maybe this article breaks all of this open within music. That said - it's still hard when a musician/artist you really care about is exposed for being a real piece of crap.
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Re: Music opinion/question of the week...

Post by Flex » 14 Feb 2019, 10:41am

WestwayKid wrote:
14 Feb 2019, 9:33am
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/13/arts ... n-sex.html

Deeply disturbing. I am a big Ryan Adams fan. His music has helped me get through some really bad times. I'm not shocked (sadly). He has a reputation for being narcissistic and obnoxious and so on - but he's gotten a pass (largely) because he was so talented. The article also mentions how music has largely avoided the #MeToo movement because that sort of behavior has long been accepted as part of the deal. I would guarantee that Gene Simmons has done worse than Ryan Adams and that's not to defend Adams at all - just a point made to highlight how ingrained it is within rock history. Personally, I find this type of behavior to be disgusting - using a position of power to hurt people - whether it's Ryan Adams "sexting" with a 14-year-old girl or Jimmy Page and a bunch of teenage groupies back in the 1970's and I'm hopeful that maybe this article breaks all of this open within music. That said - it's still hard when a musician/artist you really care about is exposed for being a real piece of crap.
Ah, shit.
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Re: Music opinion/question of the week...

Post by WestwayKid » 14 Feb 2019, 10:57am

Flex wrote:
14 Feb 2019, 10:41am
WestwayKid wrote:
14 Feb 2019, 9:33am
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/13/arts ... n-sex.html

Deeply disturbing. I am a big Ryan Adams fan. His music has helped me get through some really bad times. I'm not shocked (sadly). He has a reputation for being narcissistic and obnoxious and so on - but he's gotten a pass (largely) because he was so talented. The article also mentions how music has largely avoided the #MeToo movement because that sort of behavior has long been accepted as part of the deal. I would guarantee that Gene Simmons has done worse than Ryan Adams and that's not to defend Adams at all - just a point made to highlight how ingrained it is within rock history. Personally, I find this type of behavior to be disgusting - using a position of power to hurt people - whether it's Ryan Adams "sexting" with a 14-year-old girl or Jimmy Page and a bunch of teenage groupies back in the 1970's and I'm hopeful that maybe this article breaks all of this open within music. That said - it's still hard when a musician/artist you really care about is exposed for being a real piece of crap.
Ah, shit.
It will be interesting to see how this all plays out on several levels. It feels like this sort of behavior has been tolerated in music for too long. Somewhat selfishly - it does make me sad that Adams had to be involved. I really am a big fan of his music - even if I've always found him to be pretentious and obnoxious. His music really had helped me get through some really, really bad times. That said - I can't ignore the fact that he's allegedly done some really terrible stuff.
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Re: Music opinion/question of the week...

Post by Dr. Medulla » 14 Feb 2019, 11:39am

WestwayKid wrote:
14 Feb 2019, 9:33am
it's still hard when a musician/artist you really care about is exposed for being a real piece of crap.
We'd all be happier if we knew less about musicians, athletes, etc. Or that we not form any kind of emotional attachment to them.
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Re: Music opinion/question of the week...

Post by WestwayKid » 14 Feb 2019, 12:23pm

Dr. Medulla wrote:
14 Feb 2019, 11:39am
WestwayKid wrote:
14 Feb 2019, 9:33am
it's still hard when a musician/artist you really care about is exposed for being a real piece of crap.
We'd all be happier if we knew less about musicians, athletes, etc. Or that we not form any kind of emotional attachment to them.
Very true. I think we all (I hope) understand that the musicians, athletes and so on that we admire are human - they have faults (some bigger than others) and it becomes a balancing act - how much do we separate the artist from the art and can we ever fully do that?
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Re: Music opinion/question of the week...

Post by JennyB » 14 Feb 2019, 12:46pm

WestwayKid wrote:
14 Feb 2019, 9:33am
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/13/arts ... n-sex.html

Deeply disturbing. I am a big Ryan Adams fan. His music has helped me get through some really bad times. I'm not shocked (sadly). He has a reputation for being narcissistic and obnoxious and so on - but he's gotten a pass (largely) because he was so talented. The article also mentions how music has largely avoided the #MeToo movement because that sort of behavior has long been accepted as part of the deal. I would guarantee that Gene Simmons has done worse than Ryan Adams and that's not to defend Adams at all - just a point made to highlight how ingrained it is within rock history. Personally, I find this type of behavior to be disgusting - using a position of power to hurt people - whether it's Ryan Adams "sexting" with a 14-year-old girl or Jimmy Page and a bunch of teenage groupies back in the 1970's and I'm hopeful that maybe this article breaks all of this open within music. That said - it's still hard when a musician/artist you really care about is exposed for being a real piece of crap.
It's very hard. So many of the musicians we love are awful, awful people.
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Re: Music opinion/question of the week...

Post by Marky Dread » 14 Feb 2019, 1:45pm

WestwayKid wrote:
14 Feb 2019, 12:23pm
Dr. Medulla wrote:
14 Feb 2019, 11:39am
WestwayKid wrote:
14 Feb 2019, 9:33am
it's still hard when a musician/artist you really care about is exposed for being a real piece of crap.
We'd all be happier if we knew less about musicians, athletes, etc. Or that we not form any kind of emotional attachment to them.
Very true. I think we all (I hope) understand that the musicians, athletes and so on that we admire are human - they have faults (some bigger than others) and it becomes a balancing act - how much do we separate the artist from the art and can we ever fully do that?
I'm interested to see how this case pans out. I not suggesting he is innocent but he's hardly been found guilty of anything either. I am always suspect when these things rear their head after a long period of time. Media attention brings this stuff to the surface but it's not always through honest intentions.
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Re: Music opinion/question of the week...

Post by WestwayKid » 15 Feb 2019, 10:06am

Social media is awash today with music critics and fans who are now saying they never thought Ryan Adams was that talented and so on. They're also the same critics who would never have had time for someone like Mandy Moore - but they're now holding her up as an incredible talent (and no knock on her - she is talented). I just really dislike the knee jerk reactions of the music press. These are the same people who in reality have been swooning over Ryan Adams for nearly 20 years - thereby helping to create the pretentious monster that is Ryan Adams. I get it. The guy is a creep and he's been disgraced - but it's also okay to admit that you liked his music. Admitting that you liked his music doesn't make you guilty by association. It just seems far more legit to say hey, I liked him - but I can't support him anymore. I'm not shocked because revisionism goes hand in hand with music critics - but still...
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Re: Music opinion/question of the week...

Post by drowninghere » 15 Feb 2019, 10:38am

WestwayKid wrote:
14 Feb 2019, 9:33am
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/13/arts ... n-sex.html

Deeply disturbing. I am a big Ryan Adams fan. His music has helped me get through some really bad times. I'm not shocked (sadly). He has a reputation for being narcissistic and obnoxious and so on - but he's gotten a pass (largely) because he was so talented. The article also mentions how music has largely avoided the #MeToo movement because that sort of behavior has long been accepted as part of the deal. I would guarantee that Gene Simmons has done worse than Ryan Adams and that's not to defend Adams at all - just a point made to highlight how ingrained it is within rock history. Personally, I find this type of behavior to be disgusting - using a position of power to hurt people - whether it's Ryan Adams "sexting" with a 14-year-old girl or Jimmy Page and a bunch of teenage groupies back in the 1970's and I'm hopeful that maybe this article breaks all of this open within music. That said - it's still hard when a musician/artist you really care about is exposed for being a real piece of crap.
Surprised and proud to see Phoebe Bridgers in the article - takes a lot of courage to speak up. Anyways, she is a star, and probably worth more of your time in 2019 than Ryan Adams.



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Re: Music opinion/question of the week...

Post by WestwayKid » 15 Feb 2019, 10:41am

drowninghere wrote:
15 Feb 2019, 10:38am
WestwayKid wrote:
14 Feb 2019, 9:33am
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/13/arts ... n-sex.html

Deeply disturbing. I am a big Ryan Adams fan. His music has helped me get through some really bad times. I'm not shocked (sadly). He has a reputation for being narcissistic and obnoxious and so on - but he's gotten a pass (largely) because he was so talented. The article also mentions how music has largely avoided the #MeToo movement because that sort of behavior has long been accepted as part of the deal. I would guarantee that Gene Simmons has done worse than Ryan Adams and that's not to defend Adams at all - just a point made to highlight how ingrained it is within rock history. Personally, I find this type of behavior to be disgusting - using a position of power to hurt people - whether it's Ryan Adams "sexting" with a 14-year-old girl or Jimmy Page and a bunch of teenage groupies back in the 1970's and I'm hopeful that maybe this article breaks all of this open within music. That said - it's still hard when a musician/artist you really care about is exposed for being a real piece of crap.
Surprised and proud to see Phoebe Bridgers in the article - takes a lot of courage to speak up. Anyways, she is a star, and probably worth more of your time in 2019 than Ryan Adams.


I really like the album she did with Conor Oberst. It is really fantastic.
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Re: Music opinion/question of the week...

Post by Marky Dread » 15 Feb 2019, 10:49am

WestwayKid wrote:
15 Feb 2019, 10:06am
Social media is awash today with music critics and fans who are now saying they never thought Ryan Adams was that talented and so on. They're also the same critics who would never have had time for someone like Mandy Moore - but they're now holding her up as an incredible talent (and no knock on her - she is talented). I just really dislike the knee jerk reactions of the music press. These are the same people who in reality have been swooning over Ryan Adams for nearly 20 years - thereby helping to create the pretentious monster that is Ryan Adams. I get it. The guy is a creep and he's been disgraced - but it's also okay to admit that you liked his music. Admitting that you liked his music doesn't make you guilty by association. It just seems far more legit to say hey, I liked him - but I can't support him anymore. I'm not shocked because revisionism goes hand in hand with music critics - but still...
The music critics are so full of bullshit they just don't want to be seen as being on the wrong side. If Adams is guilty and I'm not suggesting he isn't it wouldn't stop me listening to some of his music and still thinking it's great. I have no problem in separating the artist from their music. If you bought a nice house that you loved would you knock it down becuase you found out it was built by a rapist or murderer. People are and can be terrible that's nothing new. Why should we expect musicains to be anything other than terrible people too.
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Re: Music opinion/question of the week...

Post by WestwayKid » 15 Feb 2019, 11:48am

It does raise the question of can we separate the artist from the art and should we even if we could?
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Re: Music opinion/question of the week...

Post by Marky Dread » 15 Feb 2019, 12:03pm

WestwayKid wrote:
15 Feb 2019, 11:48am
It does raise the question of can we separate the artist from the art and should we even if we could?
Okay each to his own on this but I have no problem liking music made some bloody terrible people. Gary Glitter is a classic example to me an absolute disgrace of a human being. However I'm not going into denial to say I don't enjoy those classic 70s singles. Besides he was the vocalists and there was a whole band of musicians who made those songs why should they suffer from people boycotting the sales of stuff they worked hard on. I'm certain they have famillies to feed as well.

Look at all the debauchery that has gone on in the name of Rock 'n' Roll. So no more Chuck Berry/Jerry Lee Lewis/Led Zeppelin/Sex Pistols the list of greats goes on forever.
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Re: Music opinion/question of the week...

Post by Heston » 15 Feb 2019, 12:09pm

Marky Dread wrote:
15 Feb 2019, 12:03pm
WestwayKid wrote:
15 Feb 2019, 11:48am
It does raise the question of can we separate the artist from the art and should we even if we could?
Okay each to his own on this but I have no problem liking music made some bloody terrible people. Gary Glitter is a classic example to me an absolute disgrace of a human being. However I'm not going into denial to say I don't enjoy those classic 70s singles. Besides he was the vocalists and there was a whole band of musicians who made those songs why should they suffer from people boycotting the sales of stuff they worked hard on. I'm certain they have famillies to feed as well.

Look at all the debauchery that has gone on in the name of Rock 'n' Roll. So no more Chuck Berry/Jerry Lee Lewis/Led Zeppelin/Sex Pistols the list of greats goes on forever.
This is generally my opinion but there are some whose crimes are so heinous that I don't think they should ever be played on tv or radio. Lost Prophets and Gary Glitter spring to mind.
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Re: Music opinion/question of the week...

Post by Marky Dread » 15 Feb 2019, 12:46pm

Heston wrote:
15 Feb 2019, 12:09pm
Marky Dread wrote:
15 Feb 2019, 12:03pm
WestwayKid wrote:
15 Feb 2019, 11:48am
It does raise the question of can we separate the artist from the art and should we even if we could?
Okay each to his own on this but I have no problem liking music made some bloody terrible people. Gary Glitter is a classic example to me an absolute disgrace of a human being. However I'm not going into denial to say I don't enjoy those classic 70s singles. Besides he was the vocalists and there was a whole band of musicians who made those songs why should they suffer from people boycotting the sales of stuff they worked hard on. I'm certain they have famillies to feed as well.

Look at all the debauchery that has gone on in the name of Rock 'n' Roll. So no more Chuck Berry/Jerry Lee Lewis/Led Zeppelin/Sex Pistols the list of greats goes on forever.
This is generally my opinion but there are some whose crimes are so heinous that I don't think they should ever be played on tv or radio. Lost Prophets and Gary Glitter spring to mind.
I'm not saying you are wrong but where do you draw a line in the sand.? There must be hundreds probably thousands of songs you like by people who have done some awful crimes. ;)
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