I have a bunch of mixed feelings on the efficacy of violence (and how we even define "violence"), as well as gun control (and I'm sure a search on these forums would reveal shifting, ping-ponging views from me over the years). I generally don't feel qualified to say with authority what's right or wrong from moral, strategic or tactical perspectives and my position as a white, male middle class person largely disqualifies whatever I'd have to say anyways other than: I support the views, even when they're contradictory, of movements of liberation and my goal is not to undermine shit.
Except, I will say it's deeply fucked up that we categorize the destruction of property as "violence" as if it was a person being attacked. Burning down a thousand Targets and smashing a thousand Starbucks windows doesn't begin to compare to the cops (or some psycho militia nut) murdering a single person. That I'm pretty confident about.
I agree with much of this.
I respect what people say about nonviolence but history has shown the non violent alternative is only acceptable to those in power when also faced with an armed movement. Until then they dismiss and seek to undermine those seeking nonviolent change.
I have a bunch of mixed feelings on the efficacy of violence (and how we even define "violence"), as well as gun control (and I'm sure a search on these forums would reveal shifting, ping-ponging views from me over the years). I generally don't feel qualified to say with authority what's right or wrong from moral, strategic or tactical perspectives and my position as a white, male middle class person largely disqualifies whatever I'd have to say anyways other than: I support the views, even when they're contradictory, of movements of liberation and my goal is not to undermine shit.
Except, I will say it's deeply fucked up that we categorize the destruction of property as "violence" as if it was a person being attacked. Burning down a thousand Targets and smashing a thousand Starbucks windows doesn't begin to compare to the cops (or some psycho militia nut) murdering a single person. That I'm pretty confident about.
I generally agree with all this. I'm open about my pacifism, but also know that my status and experience informs it, and that I'm pretty goddamned lucky in all that, so I can't condemn people in the street mixing it up with assholes and fascists. I disagree philosophically and so I can't endorse it, but I've never thought I have all (or any) of the answers, so it's just disagreement and willingness to discuss.
One of the things I find a bit interesting by those on the right is to invalidate any protest that involves violence, as if violence and protest are so incompatible rather than, historically, the norm. MLK's non-violent approach was so stunning and effective in no small part because non-violent protest was unusual. But on the right, it's now treated as the only legitimate form—albeit not out of respect, but to shrink the window of what is legitimate protest.
"I used to bullseye womp rats in my T-16 back in Whittier, they're not much bigger than two meters.'" - Richard Nixon, Checkers Speech, abandoned early draft
I have a bunch of mixed feelings on the efficacy of violence (and how we even define "violence"), as well as gun control (and I'm sure a search on these forums would reveal shifting, ping-ponging views from me over the years). I generally don't feel qualified to say with authority what's right or wrong from moral, strategic or tactical perspectives and my position as a white, male middle class person largely disqualifies whatever I'd have to say anyways other than: I support the views, even when they're contradictory, of movements of liberation and my goal is not to undermine shit.
Except, I will say it's deeply fucked up that we categorize the destruction of property as "violence" as if it was a person being attacked. Burning down a thousand Targets and smashing a thousand Starbucks windows doesn't begin to compare to the cops (or some psycho militia nut) murdering a single person. That I'm pretty confident about.
I don't consider the destruction of property the same as violence against a living breathing person who others may well depend upon. But smashing shop windows etc is not effective in any way. It will all be covered by insurance. Most likely someone you know works in the shop and they are now affected. When the violence is taken to the streets there are only ever losers on both sides. What also concerns me is others coming into an area from out of town to cause destruction then return home leaving the mess for those that live there to clean up and continue living there.
Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty
We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.
Don’t know how much of the Christchurch Mosque shooters sentencing has been covered overseas but listening to the victim impact statements they showed remarkable restraint and humility. Even when tempers boiled over they were able to control their actions.
I think a few lessons could be learnt in how to conduct yourself even in the face of extreme provocation.
Don’t know how much of the Christchurch Mosque shooters sentencing has been covered overseas but listening to the victim impact statements they showed remarkable restraint and humility. Even when tempers boiled over they were able to control their actions.
I think a few lessons could be learnt in how to conduct yourself even in the face of extreme provocation.
Perhaps but this is a case of apples v kiwis. There is a big difference when agents of the state pull the trigger and historically they've done so largely without fear of prosecution or of even being charged with anything..
The Milwaukee Bucks refused to come out for their Game 5 match up against the Magic today and now the Milwaukee Brewers have said they will not take the field against Cincinnati.
"They don't think it be like it is, but it do." - Oscar Gamble
The Milwaukee Bucks refused to come out for their Game 5 match up against the Magic today and now the Milwaukee Brewers have said they will not take the field against Cincinnati.
Have they given reasons? Is it fear of rioting or something else.
The Milwaukee Bucks refused to come out for their Game 5 match up against the Magic today and now the Milwaukee Brewers have said they will not take the field against Cincinnati.
Have they given reasons? Is it fear of rioting or something else.
No, in support of protesters. That pro athletes—normally pretty apolitical, don't court controversy people—are increasingly standing out is pretty remarkable and suggestive of how much the needle has moved.
"I used to bullseye womp rats in my T-16 back in Whittier, they're not much bigger than two meters.'" - Richard Nixon, Checkers Speech, abandoned early draft
The Milwaukee Bucks refused to come out for their Game 5 match up against the Magic today and now the Milwaukee Brewers have said they will not take the field against Cincinnati.
Have they given reasons? Is it fear of rioting or something else.
No, in support of protesters. That pro athletes—normally pretty apolitical, don't court controversy people—are increasingly standing out is pretty remarkable and suggestive of how much the needle has moved.
Wow, didn't expect that. I guess I could support the Brew Crew now that they are an NL team.
The Milwaukee Bucks refused to come out for their Game 5 match up against the Magic today and now the Milwaukee Brewers have said they will not take the field against Cincinnati.
Have they given reasons? Is it fear of rioting or something else.
No, in support of protesters. That pro athletes—normally pretty apolitical, don't court controversy people—are increasingly standing out is pretty remarkable and suggestive of how much the needle has moved.
Wow, didn't expect that. I guess I could support the Brew Crew now that they are an NL team.
And now all NBA playoff games have been postponed tonight.
"I used to bullseye womp rats in my T-16 back in Whittier, they're not much bigger than two meters.'" - Richard Nixon, Checkers Speech, abandoned early draft
The Milwaukee Bucks refused to come out for their Game 5 match up against the Magic today and now the Milwaukee Brewers have said they will not take the field against Cincinnati.
Have they given reasons? Is it fear of rioting or something else.
No, in support of protesters. That pro athletes—normally pretty apolitical, don't court controversy people—are increasingly standing out is pretty remarkable and suggestive of how much the needle has moved.
Wow, didn't expect that. I guess I could support the Brew Crew now that they are an NL team.
And now all NBA playoff games have been postponed tonight.
Have they given reasons? Is it fear of rioting or something else.
No, in support of protesters. That pro athletes—normally pretty apolitical, don't court controversy people—are increasingly standing out is pretty remarkable and suggestive of how much the needle has moved.
Wow, didn't expect that. I guess I could support the Brew Crew now that they are an NL team.
And now all NBA playoff games have been postponed tonight.
Good on them.
If nothing else, it makes it harder for bigots to enjoy sports.
"I used to bullseye womp rats in my T-16 back in Whittier, they're not much bigger than two meters.'" - Richard Nixon, Checkers Speech, abandoned early draft
Don’t know how much of the Christchurch Mosque shooters sentencing has been covered overseas but listening to the victim impact statements they showed remarkable restraint and humility. Even when tempers boiled over they were able to control their actions.
I think a few lessons could be learnt in how to conduct yourself even in the face of extreme provocation.
Perhaps but this is a case of apples v kiwis. There is a big difference when agents of the state pull the trigger and historically they've done so largely without fear of prosecution or of even being charged with anything..
I don’t get your point. My post was nothing to do with what is happening in America.
Don’t know how much of the Christchurch Mosque shooters sentencing has been covered overseas but listening to the victim impact statements they showed remarkable restraint and humility. Even when tempers boiled over they were able to control their actions.
I think a few lessons could be learnt in how to conduct yourself even in the face of extreme provocation.
I've heard a few news reports. A mother of one of the victims gave a great account of herself.
There's a tiny, tiny hopeful part of me that says you guys are running a Kaufmanesque long con on the board