You mentioned she was a Trump supporter when we hung out last summer. I'm sorry to hear this. My parents are fortunately seemingly fed up with Trump, but they are also not on social media, so that probably helps.
The Trump observations thread
Re: The Trump observations thread
Look, you have to establish context for these things. And I maintain that unless you appreciate the Fall of Constantinople, the Great Fire of London, and Mickey Mantle's fatalist alcoholism, live Freddy makes no sense. If you want to half-ass it, fine, go call Simon Schama to do the appendix.
Re: The Trump observations thread
I've got a friend who is really dumb to put it bluntly and he's a big Trump guy who just moved to Iowa. I find his fb post and comment threads illuminating. One recently was about Biden and climate change. Someone responded explaining the quote to him and got the following comments:
"I feel bad for you if that’s all you have to run on. Myself and my family have thrived the last “4” years because of Trump. Also not me but very many other people."
"Me too and gave me pride back in our country" (my friend)
It's fascinating how so much could be going wrong, yet this is your takeaway on the state of affairs. I think Trump makes it okay to be complacent, maintain the status quo. You don't need to question your privilege, it doesn't exist. Everything is fine the way it is, you don't have to give anything up because you are right.
"I feel bad for you if that’s all you have to run on. Myself and my family have thrived the last “4” years because of Trump. Also not me but very many other people."
"Me too and gave me pride back in our country" (my friend)
It's fascinating how so much could be going wrong, yet this is your takeaway on the state of affairs. I think Trump makes it okay to be complacent, maintain the status quo. You don't need to question your privilege, it doesn't exist. Everything is fine the way it is, you don't have to give anything up because you are right.
Look, you have to establish context for these things. And I maintain that unless you appreciate the Fall of Constantinople, the Great Fire of London, and Mickey Mantle's fatalist alcoholism, live Freddy makes no sense. If you want to half-ass it, fine, go call Simon Schama to do the appendix.
Re: The Trump observations thread
Yeah Ive already been shut out to some degree by relatives for making what I would call pretty basic truths about Trump. The bullshit about injecting disinfectant and treating people with UV-C light along with him basically being a privileged bully who has little respect for civility or other people in general. That got me disinvited from family zoom calls and group emails.
Im sure Im seen by some as the one who married the black lady and she somehow twisted my beliefs etc
- Dr. Medulla
- Atheistic Epileptic
- Posts: 115983
- Joined: 15 Jun 2008, 2:00pm
- Location: Straight Banana, Idaho
Re: The Trump observations thread
This kind of ties in with the Tom Frank book I just finished listening to (see the Reading thread). I do kind of get the resentment of a lot of these Trump people who know they are being mocked and dismissed by liberals. You're not as smart as us, your opinions don't count, if you're not successful like us, it's your own fault. Their very existence is considered valueless by the educated class. And so Trump does feel like the revenge of the marginalized. He's their fantasy—an asshole who says what he wants and drives the liberals crazy and he never apologizes. And he's in charge—everyone has to pay attention to him. I bounce back and forth between being irritated by our liberal and left scolding culture and getting fed up with bigoted assholes who refused to farther than their front yard and privilege gut thinking.matedog wrote: ↑16 Sep 2020, 5:29pmI've got a friend who is really dumb to put it bluntly and he's a big Trump guy who just moved to Iowa. I find his fb post and comment threads illuminating. One recently was about Biden and climate change. Someone responded explaining the quote to him and got the following comments:
"I feel bad for you if that’s all you have to run on. Myself and my family have thrived the last “4” years because of Trump. Also not me but very many other people."
"Me too and gave me pride back in our country" (my friend)
It's fascinating how so much could be going wrong, yet this is your takeaway on the state of affairs. I think Trump makes it okay to be complacent, maintain the status quo. You don't need to question your privilege, it doesn't exist. Everything is fine the way it is, you don't have to give anything up because you are right.
"I never doubted myself for a minute for I knew that my monkey-strong bowels were girded with strength, like the loins of a dragon ribboned with fat and the opulence of buffalo dung." - Richard Nixon, Checkers Speech, abandoned early draft
Re: The Trump observations thread
So that is a HUGE part of this problem for me. In my mind if you're stuck hating people of color, non-Christians, gay people etc the chasm is just too fucking wide. And there's plenty of educated and well off people who support this asshole agenda.Dr. Medulla wrote: ↑16 Sep 2020, 5:51pmThis kind of ties in with the Tom Frank book I just finished listening to (see the Reading thread). I do kind of get the resentment of a lot of these Trump people who know they are being mocked and dismissed by liberals. You're not as smart as us, your opinions don't count, if you're not successful like us, it's your own fault. Their very existence is considered valueless by the educated class. And so Trump does feel like the revenge of the marginalized. He's their fantasy—an asshole who says what he wants and drives the liberals crazy and he never apologizes. And he's in charge—everyone has to pay attention to him. I bounce back and forth between being irritated by our liberal and left scolding culture and getting fed up with bigoted assholes who refused to farther than their front yard and privilege gut thinking.matedog wrote: ↑16 Sep 2020, 5:29pmI've got a friend who is really dumb to put it bluntly and he's a big Trump guy who just moved to Iowa. I find his fb post and comment threads illuminating. One recently was about Biden and climate change. Someone responded explaining the quote to him and got the following comments:
"I feel bad for you if that’s all you have to run on. Myself and my family have thrived the last “4” years because of Trump. Also not me but very many other people."
"Me too and gave me pride back in our country" (my friend)
It's fascinating how so much could be going wrong, yet this is your takeaway on the state of affairs. I think Trump makes it okay to be complacent, maintain the status quo. You don't need to question your privilege, it doesn't exist. Everything is fine the way it is, you don't have to give anything up because you are right.
Re: The Trump observations thread
Hello,Dr. Medulla wrote: ↑16 Sep 2020, 5:51pmThis kind of ties in with the Tom Frank book I just finished listening to (see the Reading thread). I do kind of get the resentment of a lot of these Trump people who know they are being mocked and dismissed by liberals. You're not as smart as us, your opinions don't count, if you're not successful like us, it's your own fault. Their very existence is considered valueless by the educated class. And so Trump does feel like the revenge of the marginalized. He's their fantasy—an asshole who says what he wants and drives the liberals crazy and he never apologizes. And he's in charge—everyone has to pay attention to him. I bounce back and forth between being irritated by our liberal and left scolding culture and getting fed up with bigoted assholes who refused to farther than their front yard and privilege gut thinking.matedog wrote: ↑16 Sep 2020, 5:29pmI've got a friend who is really dumb to put it bluntly and he's a big Trump guy who just moved to Iowa. I find his fb post and comment threads illuminating. One recently was about Biden and climate change. Someone responded explaining the quote to him and got the following comments:
"I feel bad for you if that’s all you have to run on. Myself and my family have thrived the last “4” years because of Trump. Also not me but very many other people."
"Me too and gave me pride back in our country" (my friend)
It's fascinating how so much could be going wrong, yet this is your takeaway on the state of affairs. I think Trump makes it okay to be complacent, maintain the status quo. You don't need to question your privilege, it doesn't exist. Everything is fine the way it is, you don't have to give anything up because you are right.
I get a lot of this from friends who support Trump (yes, I still have friends who support Trump - although it's a bit of a challenge at times). I agree with your point about being upset with both left and right. I also think Trump supporters live out the Bowie (from Law) line:"I don't want knowledge, I want certainty." As times become more uncertain (especially for middle/lower-class white people), they want to be sure of things.
- Dr. Medulla
- Atheistic Epileptic
- Posts: 115983
- Joined: 15 Jun 2008, 2:00pm
- Location: Straight Banana, Idaho
Re: The Trump observations thread
Yeah, it's where I'm torn between believing that much of racism and homophobia, etc is driven by economic insecurity and just being a fucking selfish asshole who is driven by status. I can find the possibility of redemption in the former, but condemn to the pit the latter. Again, political vs. therapeutic.
"I never doubted myself for a minute for I knew that my monkey-strong bowels were girded with strength, like the loins of a dragon ribboned with fat and the opulence of buffalo dung." - Richard Nixon, Checkers Speech, abandoned early draft
- Dr. Medulla
- Atheistic Epileptic
- Posts: 115983
- Joined: 15 Jun 2008, 2:00pm
- Location: Straight Banana, Idaho
Re: The Trump observations thread
As I'm reading for this punk seminar I'm prepping for, one of the things that's leaping out to me is the punk tendency to privilege personal experience over "book learning." Even a contempt for the latter. It reads like the Trump supporters (and before that the Bush supporters). Personal experience is that certainty—I know what I know. Knowledge (via focused reading and consideration) often results in more doubt. So, yeah, again it comes back to that idea of gut thinking or personal experience. And it's not like experience is a bad perspective. It adds a valuable component to learning, especially when it complicates the formal learning. I'd never argue against the importance of our first-hand knowledge. But it's not always superior to book learning. Sometimes it is, but sometimes the critical, more remote position is superior. That's what both sides get wrong—they want to be right rather than want to better understand, even if it's always going to be incomplete understanding. I can't help but think we'd all be better off if we were more humble and regarded our understandings of the world as tentative.gkbill wrote: ↑16 Sep 2020, 7:07pmHello,
I get a lot of this from friends who support Trump (yes, I still have friends who support Trump - although it's a bit of a challenge at times). I agree with your point about being upset with both left and right. I also think Trump supporters live out the Bowie (from Law) line:"I don't want knowledge, I want certainty." As times become more uncertain (especially for middle/lower-class white people), they want to be sure of things.
"I never doubted myself for a minute for I knew that my monkey-strong bowels were girded with strength, like the loins of a dragon ribboned with fat and the opulence of buffalo dung." - Richard Nixon, Checkers Speech, abandoned early draft
Re: The Trump observations thread
My mom and I are constantly on the precipice of cutting ties. She contends that it's my liberal college professors that brainwashed me, whereas I contend that it was she who taught me to care about other people, to share, to accept others—she just didn't mean for me to believe any of it after I turned 18 I guess.
"Suck our Earth dick, Martians!" —Doc
- BostonBeaneater
- Autonomous Insect Cyborg Sentinel
- Posts: 11944
- Joined: 15 Jun 2008, 7:24pm
- Location: Between the moon and New York City
- WestwayKid
- Unknown Immortal
- Posts: 6704
- Joined: 20 Sep 2017, 8:22am
- Location: Mill-e-wah-que
Re: The Trump observations thread
Just makes you think what if we'd had a strong leader who had gotten out in front of this right away? Country sure would look different right now (in my opinion).
"They don't think it be like it is, but it do." - Oscar Gamble
- Dr. Medulla
- Atheistic Epileptic
- Posts: 115983
- Joined: 15 Jun 2008, 2:00pm
- Location: Straight Banana, Idaho
Re: The Trump observations thread
That's a helluva response.Kory wrote: ↑17 Sep 2020, 8:03pmMy mom and I are constantly on the precipice of cutting ties. She contends that it's my liberal college professors that brainwashed me, whereas I contend that it was she who taught me to care about other people, to share, to accept others—she just didn't mean for me to believe any of it after I turned 18 I guess.
"I never doubted myself for a minute for I knew that my monkey-strong bowels were girded with strength, like the loins of a dragon ribboned with fat and the opulence of buffalo dung." - Richard Nixon, Checkers Speech, abandoned early draft
Re: The Trump observations thread
So the latest narrative being pushed by the right is that the liberal brainwashing actually starts in elementary school with unamerican teaching.Kory wrote: ↑17 Sep 2020, 8:03pmMy mom and I are constantly on the precipice of cutting ties. She contends that it's my liberal college professors that brainwashed me, whereas I contend that it was she who taught me to care about other people, to share, to accept others—she just didn't mean for me to believe any of it after I turned 18 I guess.
- Dr. Medulla
- Atheistic Epileptic
- Posts: 115983
- Joined: 15 Jun 2008, 2:00pm
- Location: Straight Banana, Idaho
Re: The Trump observations thread
To the right, the only teacher above suspicion is named coach.revbob wrote: ↑18 Sep 2020, 11:50amSo the latest narrative being pushed by the right is that the liberal brainwashing actually starts in elementary school with unamerican teaching.Kory wrote: ↑17 Sep 2020, 8:03pmMy mom and I are constantly on the precipice of cutting ties. She contends that it's my liberal college professors that brainwashed me, whereas I contend that it was she who taught me to care about other people, to share, to accept others—she just didn't mean for me to believe any of it after I turned 18 I guess.
"I never doubted myself for a minute for I knew that my monkey-strong bowels were girded with strength, like the loins of a dragon ribboned with fat and the opulence of buffalo dung." - Richard Nixon, Checkers Speech, abandoned early draft
Re: The Trump observations thread
Oh I know, the most recent argument was about how we should defund public schools because they're "teaching kids to hate america." My aunt jumped in on that one, and it was in response to a post about COVID, and how their viewpoint sounds ridiculous (or it would to them) if you replace "sacrifice the weak to save the economy" with "sacrifice the rich to save the economy." Fuckers can't even stay on topic.revbob wrote: ↑18 Sep 2020, 11:50amSo the latest narrative being pushed by the right is that the liberal brainwashing actually starts in elementary school with unamerican teaching.Kory wrote: ↑17 Sep 2020, 8:03pmMy mom and I are constantly on the precipice of cutting ties. She contends that it's my liberal college professors that brainwashed me, whereas I contend that it was she who taught me to care about other people, to share, to accept others—she just didn't mean for me to believe any of it after I turned 18 I guess.
"Suck our Earth dick, Martians!" —Doc