“In England people were like, ‘Oh fuck, The Clash have sold out’
What "people" would that be then Don?
The same people that bought it in droves and sent it to number two in the charts. You know the actual "people" that really matter.
Or journalists. Or perhaps some old punk rockers too stuck in their ways to accept change.
Oh those people.
It's worth saying again. It's hardly a sell out commercial album! Side 2 was like being bogged down in a Vietnamese swamp when I first heard it.
Far from it. Those new to the band that bought the two big singles that both reached 17 in the UK charts must've had a bit of a shock if they then ventured to buy the album expecting more of the same.
Casbah only reached 30 in the charts on initial release so hardly pop glory in their homeland.
Yeah that'll teach me to read a little clearer. I was looking at the Canadian chart placing. But still a top 30 hit with radio play. Then I guess heavy rotation followed on MTV for the video. Can't imagine the album impressed those that was expecting similar.
Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty
We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.
“In England people were like, ‘Oh fuck, The Clash have sold out’
What "people" would that be then Don?
The same people that bought it in droves and sent it to number two in the charts. You know the actual "people" that really matter.
Or journalists. Or perhaps some old punk rockers too stuck in their ways to accept change.
Oh those people.
It's worth saying again. It's hardly a sell out commercial album! Side 2 was like being bogged down in a Vietnamese swamp when I first heard it.
It's just typical corporate product- Epic just needed a single LP with a couple radio ready singles. The Clash could have taped their farts and set them to a polka beat for the remainder of the record and no one at the label would have cared.
No, The Clash become exactly what they'd set out to destroy in an alarmingly short time. They practically begged the system to put the leash on them with their profligacy and indiscipline. Combat Rock is the kind of product all the late 60s/early 70s superstars were queefing out by the end of the decade - a couple suitable singles (preferably a love song), a bit of inept fake funk for the discos, and "eclectic" filler padding out the rest of the album in an attempt to show how Beatlesque they were.
There's no discernible difference between Combat Rock and Love Beach, or In Through the Out Door or Jazz or From the Inside or Dynasty or Discovery or Stormwatch or Mirrors or Dream Police or Lodger or any number of others. They all had the same mix of good songs ruined by inept production and abysmal filler. It's precisely why I got into The Clash and punk in the first place - I couldn't handle that shit anymore. Little did I realize.
It's fine by me if anyone loves this stuff - I thought the songs were all great live - but let's keep this all in context. There's nothing unique or revolutionary about Combat Rock, it's exactly what the record industry reduced everyone to with the tour/album/tour grind. The difference is that The Clash managed to succumb in half the time. But that's what happens when you don't stick to your guns and stay in your lane. Wander into the desert and the vultures are on your back before you know it.
“In England people were like, ‘Oh fuck, The Clash have sold out’
What "people" would that be then Don?
The same people that bought it in droves and sent it to number two in the charts. You know the actual "people" that really matter.
Or journalists. Or perhaps some old punk rockers too stuck in their ways to accept change.
Oh those people.
It's worth saying again. It's hardly a sell out commercial album! Side 2 was like being bogged down in a Vietnamese swamp when I first heard it.
Far from it. Those new to the band that bought the two big singles that both reached 17 in the UK charts must've had a bit of a shock if they then ventured to buy the album expecting more of the same.
Casbah only reached 30 in the charts on initial release so hardly pop glory in their homeland.
Casbah was a slow burner but had a healthy chart run in 82 easily making it their biggest selling UK single since Bankrobber. But not doing TOTP in such poptastic times stopped it from breaking the top 20 despite them touring the UK with Down At The Casbah Club around its release, free stickers and a delayed 12" version to try and get fans to buy twice!
It's just typical corporate product- Epic just needed a single LP with a couple radio ready singles. The Clash could have taped their farts and set them to a polka beat for the remainder of the record and no one at the label would have cared.
No, The Clash become exactly what they'd set out to destroy in an alarmingly short time. They practically begged the system to put the leash on them with their profligacy and indiscipline. Combat Rock is the kind of product all the late 60s/early 70s superstars were queefing out by the end of the decade - a couple suitable singles (preferably a love song), a bit of inept fake funk for the discos, and "eclectic" filler padding out the rest of the album in an attempt to show how Beatlesque they were.
There's no discernible difference between Combat Rock and Love Beach, or In Through the Out Door or Jazz or From the Inside or Dynasty or Discovery or Stormwatch or Mirrors or Dream Police or Lodger or any number of others. They all had the same mix of good songs ruined by inept production and abysmal filler. It's precisely why I got into The Clash and punk in the first place - I couldn't handle that shit anymore. Little did I realize.
It's fine by me if anyone loves this stuff - I thought the songs were all great live - but let's keep this all in context. There's nothing unique or revolutionary about Combat Rock, it's exactly what the record industry reduced everyone to with the tour/album/tour grind. The difference is that The Clash managed to succumb in half the time. But that's what happens when you don't stick to your guns and stay in your lane. Wander into the desert and the vultures are on your back before you know it.
Perhaps even more to the point, you can’t beat the enemy from within. Upteen bands have signed with major labels claiming they can do more damage from within because they can now spread their subversive message and blah blah blah to a wider audience. It doesn’t work that way, tho. It just doesn’t because the profit motive that drives the business at that level is way stronger than any band, and bands will inevitably make more and more compromises, which they convince themselves is for the greater subversive good. If you want to stay edgy and autonomous (or at least relatively so), stay outside to throw your rocks.
"Grab some wood, bub.'" - Richard Nixon, Checkers Speech, abandoned early draft
It's still not really clear to me that the clash were ever genuinely particularly committed to destroying or subverting anything. I think they always pretty much wanted to be pop stars and their gestures otherwise were good ways to move product. In that context, their contemporary shenanigans fit perfectly.
Wiggle, wiggle, wiggle like a bowl of soup
Wiggle, wiggle, wiggle like a rolling hoop
Wiggle, wiggle, wiggle like a ton of lead
Wiggle - you can raise the dead
It's still not really clear to me that the clash were ever genuinely particularly committed to destroying or subverting anything. I think they always pretty much wanted to be pop stars and their gestures otherwise were good ways to move product. In that context, their contemporary shenanigans fit perfectly.
At the very beginning, at UK punk's first bloom, I think so. And both very uncommercial subject matter in songs and fights about pricing later on suggest interests contrary to pop stardom. I assume they thought they could do both, but that's still more of the delusion that you can beat the house.
"Grab some wood, bub.'" - Richard Nixon, Checkers Speech, abandoned early draft
It's just typical corporate product- Epic just needed a single LP with a couple radio ready singles. The Clash could have taped their farts and set them to a polka beat for the remainder of the record and no one at the label would have cared.
No, The Clash become exactly what they'd set out to destroy in an alarmingly short time. They practically begged the system to put the leash on them with their profligacy and indiscipline. Combat Rock is the kind of product all the late 60s/early 70s superstars were queefing out by the end of the decade - a couple suitable singles (preferably a love song), a bit of inept fake funk for the discos, and "eclectic" filler padding out the rest of the album in an attempt to show how Beatlesque they were.
There's no discernible difference between Combat Rock and Love Beach, or In Through the Out Door or Jazz or From the Inside or Dynasty or Discovery or Stormwatch or Mirrors or Dream Police or Lodger or any number of others. They all had the same mix of good songs ruined by inept production and abysmal filler. It's precisely why I got into The Clash and punk in the first place - I couldn't handle that shit anymore. Little did I realize.
It's fine by me if anyone loves this stuff - I thought the songs were all great live - but let's keep this all in context. There's nothing unique or revolutionary about Combat Rock, it's exactly what the record industry reduced everyone to with the tour/album/tour grind. The difference is that The Clash managed to succumb in half the time. But that's what happens when you don't stick to your guns and stay in your lane. Wander into the desert and the vultures are on your back before you know it.
Perhaps even more to the point, you can’t beat the enemy from within. Upteen bands have signed with major labels claiming they can do more damage from within because they can now spread their subversive message and blah blah blah to a wider audience. It doesn’t work that way, tho. It just doesn’t because the profit motive that drives the business at that level is way stronger than any band, and bands will inevitably make more and more compromises, which they convince themselves is for the greater subversive good. If you want to stay edgy and autonomous (or at least relatively so), stay outside to throw your rocks.
This is The Clash we are discussing here and not Crass. Surely if you are good or even great at what you do then you want to reach a bigger audience. Those big labels owned the smaller labes anyway. I just thought The Clash were a great rock n roll band that had some positive things to say. Not a political party with guitars and drums.
I mean just look at the lousy deal they signed. They tried by putting out a double and a treble album.
Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty
We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.
It's still not really clear to me that the clash were ever genuinely particularly committed to destroying or subverting anything. I think they always pretty much wanted to be pop stars and their gestures otherwise were good ways to move product. In that context, their contemporary shenanigans fit perfectly.
At the very beginning, at UK punk's first bloom, I think so. And both very uncommercial subject matter in songs and fights about pricing later on suggest interests contrary to pop stardom. I assume they thought they could do both, but that's still more of the delusion that you can beat the house.
Yeah, maybe I mean I don't think it was necessarily ever a very deeply held commitment. And a lot of it has that "we can take a stand AND build our brand" vibe which, as you say, you can't destroy the master's factory with the master's tools.
Wiggle, wiggle, wiggle like a bowl of soup
Wiggle, wiggle, wiggle like a rolling hoop
Wiggle, wiggle, wiggle like a ton of lead
Wiggle - you can raise the dead
It's a sticky subject because, sure they can just be a good rock and roll or pop act or whatever. They aren't crass, it's true. But I don't go on other web forums to talk about all the other good rock and roll or pop acts. We're presumably animated by the clash because, even after all these years, they meant something more - whether that was intentional or even coherent on their part or not. So it's hard not to at least contemplate their music in a more considered way than if it's a fun enough listen or whatever.
I don't think you get to be The Only Band That Matters if all you are is a fine enough rock band.
Wiggle, wiggle, wiggle like a bowl of soup
Wiggle, wiggle, wiggle like a rolling hoop
Wiggle, wiggle, wiggle like a ton of lead
Wiggle - you can raise the dead
Perhaps even more to the point, you can’t beat the enemy from within. Upteen bands have signed with major labels claiming they can do more damage from within because they can now spread their subversive message and blah blah blah to a wider audience. It doesn’t work that way, tho. It just doesn’t because the profit motive that drives the business at that level is way stronger than any band, and bands will inevitably make more and more compromises, which they convince themselves is for the greater subversive good. If you want to stay edgy and autonomous (or at least relatively so), stay outside to throw your rocks.
Exactly. The House always wins. The industry saw a lot of rebels come and go and usually broke all of their backs on their way out. The System has its own genius.
It's a sticky subject because, sure they can just be a good rock and roll or pop act or whatever. They aren't crass, it's true. But I don't go on other web forums to talk about all the other good rock and roll or pop acts. We're presumably animated by the clash because, even after all these years, they meant something more - whether that was intentional or even coherent on their part or not. So it's hard not to at least contemplate their music in a more considered way than if it's a fun enough listen or whatever.
I don't think you get to be The Only Band That Matters if all you are is a fine enough rock band.
Surely room for both though. Through the ears of the listener.
Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty
We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.
It's a sticky subject because, sure they can just be a good rock and roll or pop act or whatever. They aren't crass, it's true. But I don't go on other web forums to talk about all the other good rock and roll or pop acts. We're presumably animated by the clash because, even after all these years, they meant something more - whether that was intentional or even coherent on their part or not. So it's hard not to at least contemplate their music in a more considered way than if it's a fun enough listen or whatever.
I don't think you get to be The Only Band That Matters if all you are is a fine enough rock band.
The Clash are a great story, warts and all. The fuckups and the failures are part of the mix, otherwise there's no story to tell.
It's a sticky subject because, sure they can just be a good rock and roll or pop act or whatever. They aren't crass, it's true. But I don't go on other web forums to talk about all the other good rock and roll or pop acts. We're presumably animated by the clash because, even after all these years, they meant something more - whether that was intentional or even coherent on their part or not. So it's hard not to at least contemplate their music in a more considered way than if it's a fun enough listen or whatever.
I don't think you get to be The Only Band That Matters if all you are is a fine enough rock band.
I'll say it again they were and are not "The Only Band That Matters". I hate that quote completely.
Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty
We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.
But still a top 30 hit with radio play. Then I guess heavy rotation followed on MTV for the video. Can't imagine the album impressed those that was expecting similar.
